I live in a poorer country where I live with less than 10k a year. It’s low but since my country is generally less expensive I can live (and vacation) there with some comfort as long as I don’t go crazy. I’m a frugal person so I don’t miss out on anything.
My sister and brother-in-law went to live in Europe and they are doing very well. Together they easily make 200k. I’m happy for them.
The problem starts when I visit. The country they live in is far more expensive than mine. It isn’t always a problem since I don’t have to pay for accommodation and cooking at home is sustainable. The problem is they always want to eat out and do expensive activities (for my standards). And they always leave out the price until it’s time to pay since the price is meaningless for them. At first they would chip in until my brother-in-law started pulling “it’s your turn to pay now”. Imagine being given a dinner tab that is almost as much as your monthly paycheck.
Visiting has become stressing as hell, when I should be relaxing. I tried to talk about it, that eating at home would be more affordable for me, but they quickly go back to old habits. At this point I just decided it’s not worth it to visit anymore and blow my year savings in a few days. They’re not happy and, as much as I try, I can’t make them understand how much money I make. They can’t understand you can’t buy 100 euro meals everyday when you earn less than a 200 a week.
It’s also not much better when they visit our country but at least I know what prices to expect and since I’m home I can find an excuse to ditch them.
Maybe we have just grown appart and that’s that.
“I make $X per year. I am happy to go out, but you’ll have to shout me”?
Pretty blunt, but maybe being clear about the number would help?
I can’t imagine being that blind to income disparity! My sibling is not (yet) as well off as me and my partner. When they visit, they doesn’t spend a dime! I often offer to pay for the traveling as well, but they mostly refuse unless it’s peak holiday season. I know I like things that are likely out of their usual budget and i don’t want our visits to turn into an economical burden. When other friends visit, I also try to be mindful about it.
When I was a student on a student budget, the deal was always that who travels paid for the travel costs, who hosts paid for everything else.
Just state what you said here.
“Hey guys, going out is going to cost me a months wages. Remember where you came from the salaries are still low”
It’s similar to a situation with my friends, except I am the one with more money and I am considerate about it. (I’m one of the first to finish education and have a regular job)
If I want to do something expensive with them and they don’t consider it worth it, I either pay for them or we don’t do it. I never nag them for it because that is just not nice behaviour.
Honestly I think you should just be kind of straightforward with them and let them know that at home you were doing fine but once you are over there you’re basically going through a Year’s worth of savings eating out like that. I would say to be clear with them on that point and as long as you’ve gotten that through then that’s what you needed to get through to them.
Maybe they will have time to think about it and realize the situation they are putting you in or maybe they won’t. Either way you shouldn’t need to overspend to be around them.
If they realize what’s going on and change then good, you will be able to continue to see them and have them in your life, but if not I think it’s probably best to just keep the relationship long distance with them.
They have grown with more money and their view towards lower classes has been blinded.
They haven’t. They have grown up in the same country as I, they just moved about 10 years ago.
People forget where they came from, after a while.
deleted by creator
“Blinded” may be a little strong, but they’ve forgotten what it’s like to live with significantly less. It happens - I’m sure people who went to school and then found a decent job and improved their situation, ten years on, probably have different financial reflexes than they did just a few years prior.
I think an honest and direct conversation is warranted. Explain it just as you have here, and tell them that you love to come visit them but simply don’t have the means to do the same activities and dine at the same places as they’re used to. Maybe offer to cook for them in their own home - who wouldn’t love a home cooked meal from their home country? A 20x income disparity is significant, and unfortunately for you the decision may be that you have to visit less frequently if you need to save up for activities.
I’m in relationships with people that have much more and people that have much less financially, and I work to be mindful of it. If I’m going somewhere to eat with someone who isn’t as financially stable I insist on paying, and likewise I fight a little (but not too much) when someone insists on paying for me.
How are you able to visit Europe on that low of an income?
Large areas of North Africa have wages like that and very cheap travel to parts of Europe. It’s definitely possible
Saving.
Europe is a large place, I’ll leave it at that.
I understand it. I have emigrated like your sister, only that my relationship with money is not the standard. Given the terrible inflation, I was used to live without any savings… I was making 500 USD per month, and spending everything. Some (poorer) friends perhaps only liked me because of that. I think it’s not like I was buying their love or anything… just didn’t mind. Tried to be quite stoic/ anarchist about it. But then, that’s me.
The standard (capitalist) way to go about money is that it’s yours as your soul. It’s an essence. You don’t share. Unless when you do a gift (e.g. birthdays)… And, even couples split tabs. Also, the standard (patriarchal) way about money is that Males pay. So your brother in law is just spitting the misery cassette.
We (commentators) can blame all we want on this people. It won’t make OP feel any better.
OP: I think that a difficult talk with your sister and/or brother in law is due. Perhaps even a letter (you can also ask someone else to proofread/ help). Tell them how you feel… That way, they’ll know why you are not visiting so often. If they are really shitty about it and get mad or anything else other than comprehend, then that’s onto them.
PS. Do they have kids? I am an uncle, and my niece is in another country. But thankfully, since I emigrated, I have a not-so-dissimilar salary to my brother so I can plan holidays together… I’m actually looking forward to that. It will be our first.
deleted by creator
So, if I’m poor, I’m not allowed to have friends?
That’s not what I read. And OP statement is a fact, peoples living standards change based on their income. This is also true for people that spend more time studying and/or start having more hobbies than their initial circle. You eventually make new friends that have your new lifestyle.
P.s.: I still get together with most of my good childhood friends, but definitely not the same amount that used to be. Sometimes they only want to do and talk about things that I’m no longer interested in and the other way around.
deleted by creator
