Currently I’m using Joplin with Syncthing-backed file system synchronization. I’m pretty pleased with it, as I do like tagging- and Markdown-based systems.
I plan to upgrade to server-based synchronization, but before doing that, however, I wanted to see what other people are using.
Edit: So far I see a slight favor towards Joplin and Logseq, but I totally didn’t expect (and appreciate) getting so many different answers.
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Logseq, it’s a lot like Obsidian as it also has knowledge graphs, tags, is markdown-based and self-hostable but, in contrast to Obsidian, it’s fully open source
Much prefer Logseq as well.
Checking out Logseq now. I switched to Obsidian a few months ago and have been really liking it. Was time to switch it up from org-mode after YEARS of using it
Logseq user here too.
However, for a quick, transitory note, I use Kate or, more recently, Xpad. Only then I transcribe the content to Logseq. Why?
Because while Logseq is great as an outliner and for network thinking, it’s as graceful and agile as an elephant.
The gist of what I’m saying is: for now, and for me (hardware might be playing a role here, but I don’t think so) Logseq is a good note database. For quick typing, I have to use something else.
Unsaved n++ tabs
There’s dozens of us
Tabs right?
New33
This is the way
I do that for some random notes, but I prefer app like Obsidian for managing notes/todo lists for some stuff like projects, etc.
It automatically restoring all those unsaved notes has made me so lazy.
Obsidian is where I landed after trying several.
Just tried it for a bit. Looks pretty sleek and has some nice features, but it seems like it’s not open-source, which is something I’d like to avoid.
Then Logseq. It’s an outliner (each line can be it’s own…thing…), but it’s open source and a direct competitor of Obsidian. In fact, I was ambivalent between the two when I first started with online note-taking.
Does it store files in plain text?
I think, like Obsidian, it stores them as markdown files.
👍👍
That looks very interesting, mostly because it’s so different. I’ll have to take a closer look later.
I am not trying to defend Obsidian here in regards to its closed source but in the least the notes are not obscured in some database and use markdown format. So once they go away from that, I am out and still have all my notes accessible.
Joplin. Obsidian is not open source, doesn’t have native self hosting and it gets complicated. Joplin is very simple and just works. Although, it stores the notes in a hashed database, so you can’t edit raw files without Joplin client
Good call on Obsidian not being FOSS! I don’t know that.
Trilium for the same reasons, but the featureset of Trilium is more like Obsidian.
Trillium was originally created to be an open source replacement for Roam Research.Trilium came out in 2017, and had Roam-like features before Roam even existed. It’s similarities to Obsidian are purely coincidental, probably because Obsidian is designed to be a cross between Roam and Evernote.Please, I don’t want to be rude, so don’t take me wrong.
I think that’s not accurate. Trillium is not even an outliner, let alone a block note taking app. I think you’re mixing trillium with Logseq.
My memory may be failing me, but I think trillium has been around longer than Roam Research.
And yes, it’s a great open source note taking app!
I started using Trilium in early 2020, with version 0.40.2. Roam had released in 2019 and was growing in popularity quickly, I heard a lot about Roam, it looked cool, so I googled for an open-source self-hosted knowledge base note taking app with similar features to Roam, like notes arranged in a knowledge graph, and a backlinks explorer for each note. The only one that was available then was trilium. Looks like you’re right, the development of trilium was started in 2017, before Roam existed. This is a great interview with the creator, answers a lot of the questions I had. https://console.substack.com/p/console-169
Obsidian didn’t come out until a few months later (and remained under the radar until 2021), all my colleagues and friends use Obsidian now, but I prefer trilium. I had never heard of logseq before I read this thread. Just a quick glance, I see the first 0.1.0 version logseq was in April 2021, just before the first obsidian release.
Problem with Joplin: The raw files are randomly named so you can’t easily find a specific note
That’s not even the bigger problem. I found the desktop ui very clunky. There were too many papercuts for me to keep using joplin. However, its TUI and mobile app are excellent.
Obsidian. I know it’s not open source, but it just felt right.
Yep just swapped over from a self hosted solution with gitlab and sublime… But that was to restrictive and the overall experience wasnt really good…
I then found a post somewhere on lemmy a post abotu PKMS and what people are using… One was obsidian… So I tried it and I’m really happy
Edit: I saw some comments about some missing self hosting. Since the notes are saved as standard md files you easily ca sync them with whatever you want… I set it up with my synology NAS and DS Drive, but any tool which can sync two-ways should be fine
Just fyi notesnook is not really “zero knowledge”. They’re misusing that term.
I didn’t make that claim though. Regardless, that wouldn’t matter in a self-host situation.
Notesnook makes that claim. Why wouldn’t you consider that relevant when it’s the first thing you’re presented with on their website? And don’t even mention self hosting, that’s not only the last item on their roadmap but it’s also been there for a very long time with no updates.
Not sure why you’re getting defensive, this has nothing to do with you.
Not defensive at all, just didn’t know where your comment came from. Do you have a link I can check out regarding that? Happy to read up on it. As far as self host, Dev team stated in their discord channel that they are still planning on it but want to get it buttoned up because once it’s launched they can’t take it back, paraphrasing what he actually said.
That’s fine, I was just trying to add the the conversation.
There’s this page that actually explains the encryption as it is: https://vericrypt.notesnook.com/ Zero knowledge is mentioned here and in a few other places. They’re misusing the term as a marketing device, knowingly or not I couldn’t say.
As for how I know? It’s easy enough to check zero knowledge by logging into the service. If a password is enough to display your notes, the service is not zero knowledge. There should be a second set of credentials known only to the user that gets entered with each new login to actually decrypt the contents of your notes. If you’ve ever used matrix chat you would either enter in the private key yourself or match some emojis on an already authenticated client that would then pass that private key in a peer-to-peer fashion.
I haven’t verified this myself but I can clearly see from the website how the encryption is described vs the marketing terms being used.
I see. Admittedly it’s been a minute since I’ve logged into a new session of Notesnook. But accessing the web portal prompts for my login name, password, and then a 2FA code sent to my email address. Within the app (at least on Android) there is an option for no privacy, some privacy, and max privacy. Which have various behaviors when you navigate away from the app or close and reopen. I’m no expert, but do these sound like zero knowledge in this context?
I’ve still not decided whether I’ll stick with them, but I do like the app and was able to get a year of their pro membership for less than half off, so I figured I’d give it a try and at the very least support the devs to some degree.
Not being open source is the great… sin for me. Note taking is an investment in the future, and betting on a closed source platform is a big no no—for me, that is.
I know the content is safe in Obsidian, since it’s just Markdown files. But the workflow? Not so much.
And I know the developers behind Obsidian have their reasons to close source it. Nothing against that. But since that’s their way, it’s not my way.
Joplin as well, syching my 3 devices with the WebDAV option. I checked a few other options about a year ago and Joplin seemed the best.
Joplin is where I landed, as well as hosting my own Joplin Server.
If Obsidian allowed a free self hosted option, I would have picked it over Joplin. (Yes, I tried the free plugin, but it at times wouldn’t sync correctly and I would end up losing notes.)
I use Obsidian - it’s phenomenal! https://avidandrew.com/elevate-your-note-taking-with-obsidian.html
Logseq
Trillium although I wish it has multiple users on the same instance, other than that it’s amazing and suits my needs.
I was a fan too, but lost the portable version I was using when my usb died. The version I pulled off git now freezes every 10 seconds and closes itself down a lot. Not sure how they made it worse but it’s worse now.
Were you downloading master or the latest release? If you’re interested in using it, post the issue you have on their GitHub. The main dev is super helpful
cant you download the earlier version instead?
Logseq.
I used Joplin in the past, but just didn’t quite get completely comfortable with it.
I also tried Nextcloud in the past… that project has become too big for my needs and the file syncing had issues.
Logseq is very similar to Joplin (ie markdown files), but IMHO the editor is easier with Logseq, plus the files are just simple plaintext files, named after the page title, so are easy to edit outside of the application (and immediately update in the app)
At first, I was a little unsure of Logseq’s default of working as a daily journal, but after a while it makes more sense for me - I use it at work, so 99.9% of my notes are meetings, tasks that occur during daily life… and of course those daily journals can refer to other “non-time based” project pages…
I also use syncthing to sync the notes between android phone, linux and Windows laptops and my NAS… so that wouldn’t change for you.
https://notion.so It’s a web-based editor with a good android app. Has basic formatting, plugins/integrations, and dark mode. It’s free for individual use cases. Has some nice paid features for collaboration and business use cases, though the free plan still allows sharing and concurrent editing.
E: noticed this is in self hosted after posting. Maybe not what you’re looking for, but it’s a good service if you’re ok with that.
My only problem with them is the android app, while it has nice features it’s soo slow that even on flagship phones it is hard to use, and when you have multiple accounts switching between them is awful, either the files won’t load or it won’t refresh the interface at all. I usually switch the workspace and then restart the app. Sometimes I can’t open the subfiles of a file until I restart the app and wait for it to load.
I think the reason for that is touch screen, it is only good for social media. I use Google Keep on Android because it is fast and later copy the notes to Notion.
Idk, from what I heard the iOS version of the app is really performant and optimized.
Wish there was a self-hosted version of notion with all the same features
The closest is nextcloud collectives, tables, tasks and deck
Obsidian, and there’s also another one that’s not yet self-hostable but planning to, called Notesnook
I’ve been running the Joplin server for over a year with clients on four laptops and three phones and share notes with my wife and its wonderful. There are certainly quirks and sometimes sync issues but by and large I’m really happy with it. There seems to be one cluster of notes I have that always irritates a fresh client sync and it shows up at 50 conflicts but I work through it. Also my notebooks are huge and the first sync can take an hour. It’s a lot slower than I’d expect.
I’ve been running Joplin server for about two years now, and I concur. It’s been great.
A nice grid lined notebook and a mechanical pencil is still my favorite.
I like to use Google Keep for certain things, but I have a hard time explaining how those things are better for Google Keep.
I’m looking at giving Neorg a try.
A nice grid lined notebook and a mechanical pencil is still my favorite.
If only my default font wasn’t so bad that it causes data loss.
I also really liked Google Keep. Carnet was at one point a decent drop-in replacement on Android+Nextcloud, but it got progressively bitrotted over time and now I just use Nextcloud Notes until I find something better.
Ever try Quillpad? I don’t love that it’s sync is stuck on Nextcloud, but it’s the best feature for feature keep replacement that I could find.
Logseq with Syncthing!
Love the journal style to it
Testing this out now.
Me too. Something about the bullet point style of note taking just clicked in me, and now I can’t go back.
