Its more about being on the edge of hardware. The kernel is still being updated to support my chip. What wrapper goes around that kernel is secondary. What fedora allows is for me to stay up to date as relevant kernel patches come through.

piss

Yeah I’m paying attention to some arch builds for my machine. I’ve gone deep enough that I’m literally following the https://lkml.org/ to see how support for my machine and the chipset is going. Its why I’m prob going back to fedora after this, so I can stay on the latest kernel.

Ngl, as I’m sure its not actually Greeezy Newsom, but whoever they’ve got putting these posts together is goat-tier shit poster.

WHO KNEW THAT PIGGIES HIBERNATE. NOT I.

"If we don’t hold our own accountable and show them they’re replaceable, why would they court our votes and not the racists?”

I mean thats exactly it. If they’ve taken your vote for a given, and they will if they can, they won’t compete for it. And it loses elections.

aaaaaAAAANNnnndd…

When it is feckless Democrats who do get into office, and they do jack about shit… Where does that leave us, on the ground, trying to make the argument that people should vote for this party. When Schumer and Jefferies just roll over and show their bellies to the Trumps of the worlds, how the hell do they expect me to make an argument to an unconvinced voter who doesn’t believe that government can be effective, how do I convince that voter that things can be different?

I mean weren’t you quite literally just making an accusation of lacking reading comprehension?

You aren’t engaging with the substance of my argument, and instead try and dismiss it based on its tone. As you said:

I downvoted you for being so condescending

You are tone policing. You can’t/ won’t engage with the substance, so you focus on the decorations of the argument.

Hmm. Well I was on a tear of trying new operating systems trying to get a bit of bleeding edge kit working. I was about to be traveling and I needed it to just work. Bazzite had a release specific to my model… and it all seemed hunky dory, until it wasn’t and I couldn’t get in and wrench. I think in that week I probably went through 20+ different ISO’s and install scripts trying to get to an install that would let me use the GPU acceleration I paid for. Tried fedora, bazzite (and bazzite did work, but I had issues with the wifi/ blue tooth driver, but I had to do containers/ sandboxes to actually use RoCM), ubuntu, others.

I ended up on Ubuntu for this machine because at least I can wrench on things, and I wasn’t prepared to take the Arch jump off the diving board (at least not on a new machine before traveling). And its been “fine”.

But I genuinely do no like the Ubuntu experience. Once I can slick this machine (when I’m done with my current project), I’m going to go to Fedora because that should allow me to stay with the most up to date kernel.

100%

But we’re winning this fight. We’ve made huge strides in getting the narrative that actually, its the Democratic party thats the problem, over the course of the past 2 years. But we’re still not there yet.

Until the working class completely subverts the DNC to their collective will, and actually democratizes the party, we’re not there yet. And every apologist who tells you to vote against your own interests because ABWD is part of the problem.

Yeah I tried Bazzite. Idk if its because I’m already in club tuxedo, but the whole immutability thing did not work for me when it didn’t work with my hardware out the gate.

But if it had, wow, what a slick experience.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tone_policing

Sounds like you’ve got an emotional attachment to a political party and feel as if you are being attacked.

Although I’m not sure disengagement from the (corrupt and intentionally ineffectual) two party system does much more than to continue to disenfranchise left voices - absent substantial momentum towards 3rd-spaces not present (or being built) today.

Again, where is that being advocated for? The point I’ve been explicitly making is that defending Democrats from criticism is counter productive. And no, I’m not blaming the two party system for this. I’m explicitly blaming the “ABWD/ BlueMAGA” culture around the Democratic party. Its the problem. We could have beaten Trump, easily, if this were not the dominant paradigm (at least at the time) in the Democratic party.

But your tone comes across poorly,

I don’t care. Because almost exclusively, its BlueMAGA/ ABWD that have a problem with it, and the they’re the barrier to stopping fascism in this country and have been the entire time.

I would close by saying, I haven’t seen you assert a compelling positive solution to what you problematize correctly, other than don’t vote / vote 3rd party (which no one sees as the answer, maybe not even you?).

Where did I assert that? Show me. You (and a multitude of others) make that assumption because I point out that when Blue MAGA brigades against those themselves who may want to discuss a third party, or not voting, that drives people away from the party. Do you see your strawman more clearly now?

And I agree with the sentiment of the biline, I am proposing a solution, at least implicitly:

Stop defending shitty Democrats or the shit polices they insist on. When they are doing dumb shit, call them out on it and stop just carrying water. Hear, acknowledge, accept and support the critique. Demand better candidates, better policies, and better governance from Democrats. Stop engaging in a rhetoric that has results in a race to the bottom of the barrel when it comes to candidate quality among Democrats. When you silence criticisms or try and pretend that voting is a binary, you hurt Democrats ability to win elections. When people tell you they can’t or don’t want to vote for Democrats, hear them, and try to understand why they are saying that, and instead of trying to change the voters opinion to support a lower caliber of candidate, demand more from the candidates themselves.

You can’t move an electorate over the course of a campaign. It makes no statistical practical sense. Projects like that take decades. You always need to meet the electorate where they are at, and if a candidate is insufficient to do so, the candidate or their policies are what needs to change. When you tell voters they’re the ones who need to change their priorities to support a candidate who doesn’t support them, you just lost us another voter, and you perpetually make it harder to get Democrats elected.

ABWD/ Blue MAGA loses us elections. The “strategic voting” trope that tells voter they need to accept less loses us elections. Campaigns that work to tell voters they need to compromise instead of working to change candidates lose us elections.

You are not winning anyone over with your rhetoric in your first posts

Oh I am though, I promise. This is the one thing I do know without a doubt, because I’ve watched the entire narrative completely flip. And I know whose minds have been changed and I’ve seen how severely weakened the ABWD/ Blue MAGA side has become. I’m also not basing this off one thread or one comment, but all of them, and the complete shift in narrative we (its not just me) have been able to drive by being right in the first place and consistent with where we place our criticism. We made these critiques before it was obvious they would lead to failure; we made them while the process was leading to failure; and we make them again, now that the process has been demonstrated to lead to failure.

We may not be winning over those who are so irrationally committed to a team sport their brain is broken, but what matters now isn’t “winning them over”; its inoculating the rest of the community against listening to them. Those people are lost, broken-brained individuals, those are Blue-MAGA, and like traditional MAGA, its a cult we can’t really expect their heads to ever become fully removed from their own asses. But there are two outcomes to consider in this case. Either A) we don’t need to worry about those voters, because, if they are truly blue MAGA/ ABWD, they’ll just have to vote for the candidate who is going to speak to a populist progressive agenda and get along. Or B) they are voters you were never going to be able to rely on in the first place, and assuredly shouldnt base your campaign around. In either case, basing campaigns around them is a surefire recipe for disaster, as we’ve seen, repeatedly.

To your other points, they are entirely straw men and not worth responding to. You are effectively doing exactly what I’m accusing Blue MAGA of doing. Its a effort to use group identity to silence criticism of that identity.

Uh no.

Not the kinds of things I need to be able to do. There simply isn’t the support. Taken a ridiculous amount of time to get even basic support to do the kinds of things I need to be able to do on AMD hardware.

Valve phone? I don’t really want an arm steam deck. It’s important to me I be able to run stuff outside of games on my deck. It’s not just a handheld, it’s a full fledged pc in a handheld body.

But if they want to make a valve phone with a Linux based os…

Oh it was so much more beyond that. And it’s seems like , by looking at the dv ratios, they’ve forgotten their shame.

If you made any obvious criticisms of the campaign, you were dv’d to oblivion. If you pushed that Biden should be removed as candidate, you were dv’d to oblivion. If you were promoting the idea that the party needed to pivot on Gaza or they’d lose the election, dv’d to oblivion. That Bidens mid summer attempt at the worst border bill we’d ever seen would lose him the election. And on and on and on… I mean they litterally bullied people even mentioning third parties in a way that I think should have gotten them banned permanently from Lemmy. And how many votes did all of the third parties get? not even enough to make a difference to a fart in the wind.

Every single issue that could have turned the tide for the Dems this last election cycle, the same people downvoting in this thread, they downvoted those same things in the run up to the election.

AND THAT is why they are blue MAGA. This is a team sport for them. They can not withstand criticism of what they’ve come to associate their identity with. It’s always that you just need to get in behind the party, no matter how bad the parties ideas are. And the biggest issue these people don’t recognize: if you are downvoting in this thread **you are why the Dems lost **

The Dems were running bad candidates and worse strategies. They needed to be corrected. And defending them from that critique, preventing them from hearing it by keeping out of the mainstream for as long as they were able to, that is what lost the election. There was ample time to course correct in Summer of 24. But blue MAGA insisted you have to run the incubamant, in spite of the fact they were polling at some of the lowest levels in history and had been since almost 23.

And we had a repreive from these idiots for about 12 months while they hid from the shame of the damage they did. Now they’re back and they seem to think they’ve got the right of it again.

I gotta be honest, its fucking exhausting constantly having to explain to the people who just threw the election to Trump why they are the problem.

And honestly, if you don’t know what Blue Maga is, or why that may apply to you, why the fuck do you think its my job to educate you? You are in a politics forum. Go google it. Heres the kym, though it could be updated.

And here is Jon Stewart, in a longer form segment, explaining it further:

The reason you get put into this camp, is the apologetics. Its the approach to rhetoric. Its approaching the issue with the argument “other side worse” as if thats an argument for your positioning. Its Joy Ann Reid saying she’d vote for Biden if he was in a coma. Its Whoopi on The View saying she’d vote for Biden if he was shitting his pants on stage. And when you make these kinds of arguments, like the one you are making, you end up with a candidate who is practically in a coma and is basically shitting their pants on stage: and that loses the election.

Its an approach to electoralism that excuses the consistent and perpetual failure of the Democratic party by trying to shift the focus to how bad Trump is, and it handed the election to Trump. Twice. You don’t win elections this way, you literally push votes away from the party in using this argument. 2024 wasn’t lost because Trump was some amazing candidate. It was lost because Blue-MAGA Democrats told the entire voter base to shut the fuck up and let them run the milquetoast Democrats.

Oh its just a fight thats been going on within the party, basically forever. One side says “vote blue no matter who” as a cudgel that lets feckless moderates rule the party, then no one shows up on election day when the feckless moderates run campaigns under the assumption that their voters have no other options. And thankfully, we’ve now got the data in to recognize the people who put this toxic rhetoric out there as the very reason Democrats lose elections.

If you defend the perpetual worthlessness of Democrats, you are the problem. If all you can do is “Trump bad”, you are part of the problem. If you are a “blue no matter who”, blue maga democrat, you are why Democrats keep losing elections. Its not strategic voting if the strategy costs you elections. And you literally just cost us 2024 running a campaign based on this rhetoric, so as the part of the Democratic party that actually wants to win elections, we kindly ask you to shut the fuck up and take the back seat. Because you lose us elections with that voter blaming blue maga shit.

Its not worth my time to explain this, yet again, when I spent 2 years telling people that if they tried this approach again, and its an incredibly well trodden issue, but I can assure you this, if the rhetoric you are approaching this conversation with is the same that you approach voting with: I consider you to be the reason Democrats lost in 2016 and 2024.

Holding your nose and voting for the non-MAGA option

Man we’re really going to have to slog through this fucking election throwing blue-maga shit again aren’t we?