Is anyone actually surprised by this?
DeepSeek does the same things that OpenAI does, but it’s a foreign actor so OOooooOOWwwwooOOOO sCaRrRey!
Wait until they hear what data Instagram/Meta collects during use!
But they’re a US company so it’s ok.
Realistically what is the worst thing China is doing with your private data? Selling it? If you’re not a Chinese National, at least you don’t fall under their jurisdiction.
If you’re a U.S. citizen, with all the tech oligarchs cozying up to the current administration, I’d be a lot more concerned with Facebook/Twitter/Etc collecting your data.
Realistically what is the worst thing China is doing with your private data?
Probably mapping out the extended support networks of democratic activists in Taiwan to prepare to throw them in jail after a forcible military takeover.
So democratic activists in Taiwan have extensive networks in the US?
I mean, you said it.
Extensive networks with their close ally? My pearls must be clutched!!
Networks with a foreign actor undermining national sovereignty, which financed several massacres in your country
My country? Not sure what you’re talking about but I know that Taiwan deserves sovereignty. You don’t? Surely you’re not pro imperialism…
Strawmanning the open source federated social media enthusiast crowd as unaware fans of meta?
As a US citizen, I prefer services that US consumer protections could apply to. (While we still have them, ahem.) I know that Chinese laws will not protect me from things a Chinese business does in China.
(What’s with the rude replies? Did I fail to notice what instance I’m on or something?)
As a chauvinist
Ftfy
This makes me sad, that we can’t engage in civil discussion about this. Why did you assume and not ask questions? Be curious, not judgmental.
To me it’s a question of laws. The laws of the U.S. at least somewhat constrain the people of my own country, and can prevent them from working against their own citizens. Like me.
Please be kind when replying.
Fuck civility, its a tool of oppression
That sinophobia isn’t going to stoke itself!
Pathetic
Western authorities have been harvesting data for a few decades from social media so any complaint that singles out Chinese apps doing the same is obviously rooted in sinophobia.
The fact you think my joking about racists doing that is pathetic shows which side of that assertion you fall.
My content on here speaks for it self… Dear
rAyCIsM 🤡
The response the deepseek has been so transparent and cliched .
I thought more of Mashable. , but I suppose it’s good when they show you who they really are
I’m not American so they are indeed a foreign actor.
Nope you can’t run chatgpt locally.
but it’s a foreign actor so OOooooOOWwwwooOOOO sCaRrRey!
I love that people think this is a solid own. Lest we forget Hong Kong, or an impending hot war in Taiwan or building out extradition systems with an expanding network of countries to forcibly repatriate and torture dissidents and human rights lawyers.
You used to not have to explain why authoritarianism was bad.
Edit: I would love to know the Pro side of what happened in Hong Kong, or the forced extradition regime, since evidently I’m clearly in the wrong in thinking those were bad. What am I missing?
It used to not be necessary because democracies used to have moral authority but since the revelations of Manning and Snowden non-Americans see no difference between giving our data to the USA or to China or any other. We also know from the reaction to the war in Ukraine and Gaza that human rights claims are only sometimes used.
or an impending hot war in Taiwan
When you can’t even find things that China actually has done to complain about, so you have to start complaining about things they haven’t done.
Anti terrorism is good, actually. I don’t support people kicking seniors for speaking mandarin to try to bully a government into not prosecuting murderers in the mainland, which was the reason the protests happened (that and Washington money)
This “China’s AI is taking your data and that’s bad” is shockingly similar to “TikTok is taking your data and that’s bad”. Lots of US counterparts do the same thing, but I don’t see (as much) media coverage about that.
Don Draper: “no no no, everyone else’s cigarettes are dangerous. Lucky Strikes are… toasted.”
These the excuses you start to make when you’re losing. Not looking great for the US…
This is probably only a problem with the online version. In contrast to google and openAI they, like meta, let you download the model and run it offline, where they can’t access any of this data I presume.
I’ve been running it locally using ollama, works completely offline, no keystroke data for anyone!
Yeah I scan logs and so far nothing… I still don’t trust them but I can’t tell shit either
Just use little snitch, open snitch or simple wall depending on your operating system and block the outbound connection if one ever occurs
portmaster?
I heard about little snitch, is there any benefit to it v portmaster in your opinion, off the cuff type thing?
Oh little snitch was just what I used when macOS was my main operating system. When I switched to windows I started using simple wall and I just recently was poking around for a Linux solution and I found open snitch
Right, the offline version (if you have the hardware to run it) is completely under your control, and no one can take that away from you. Honestly nice to see that happen, I thought it would take several years.
They all do this…
Don’t use hosted models unless you pay for your own server space and it is encrypted.
Don’t be a fucking idiot.
They all store data on Chinese servers?
🤡
Unironically quite a lot of them probably do because it’s probably cheap and they have a fiduciary duty to the shareholders to gEt ThE bEsT dEaL!
Anyone using DeepSeek as a service the same way proprietary LLMs like ChatGPT are used is missing the point. The game-changer isn’t that a Chinese company like DeepSeek can compete with OpenAI and its ilk—it’s that, thanks to DeepSeek, any organization with a few million dollars to train and host their own model can now compete with OpenAI.
On-prem vs. Cloud, basically. On-prem just magically got cheaper.
Onprem has always been cheaper. Cloud compute was the most successful marketing campaign I can think of.
Or open source groups can make a fully open repro of it: https://github.com/huggingface/open-r1
I’d like to look into that, how can I train an existing model further?
I’m only playing around with ollama, but like to do a bit more - mostly just to fulfill my needs to understand things - but have no idea where to start
You’re going to have to learn python.
Here’s a good overview: https://huggingface.co/docs/transformers/training
Python is not a problem
SW Dev is my job. Just never had real contact with AI before, besides playing around a bit.Thank you very much for the link!!
Edit: thank you very much again, that was pretty much exactly what I was looking for.
Don’t know how I missed to checkout huggingface. Thought of it always just as a github for models and didn’t bother checking for docs…
But that’s a great intro with simple tools/tutorials to get a grip on it, thanks!
“We store the information we collect in secure servers located in the People’s Republic of China”
Now you Americans know how we Europeans feel when Google, Amazon and Facebook store our information on American servers. Hint: The protective wall between Chinese servers and their government are about as good as the one between American servers and their government - at least for non-US citizens. The last thin veil of privacy for Eurpeans has been ripped to shreds by Trump last week.
The last thin veil of privacy for Eurpeans has been ripped to shreds by Trump last week.
What did he do? I know Trump does not like the GDPR, but did he sign something affecting it last week?
He killed the EU-US Data Privacy Framework. Theoretically, no company is allowed to transfer data of European citizens to US-based servers anymore. Sadly, Ursula von der Leyen is lacking the balls to act on this.
Thanks, I did not know. I think you are referring to this: https://www.freevacy.com/news/noyb/trumps-actions-to-dismantle-pclob-threatens-eu-us-data-transfers/6088
To be completely honest… as an European I would be happy if they actually did make it so that no EU-US data transfer were allowed… we need to stop depending on all these US-based services… but like you said, they probably don’t have the balls to pull the plug. Which makes me wonder if that board was actually really any protection at all for privacy or it had always been an empty shell used as an excuse on both sides just to keep up appearances and maintain the plug on.
I honestly think this could be a win for us. Worst case scenario, nothing really changes but some masks fall off and at least some people would stop acting under false pretense (which could open the doors for change). So I’m actually glad he did that.
Did the American technology giants think they had the monopoly on capturing human input too?
My gym sock captures human input too.
That’s human output surely?
I input it into the sock.
I’m confused. Isn’t “collecting keystroke data” just an alarmist way to describe text entry?
Maybe. They could also be doing things like paying attention to input cadence and typos/pre-send typo corrections to use as part of a fingerprint associated with the identifying information a user gives them when creating an account so that they can then attempt to detect the user elsewhere on the web whether they are using an identifying account or not.
This argument applies to literally every single web app you use.
So, basically using Facebook technology in their AI app?
You’ll hear no arguments from me on that point, US tech companies are toxic af.
How far we’ve come
this. i mean, the session logs for the prompt are kept at least for your user, right?
This is the full paragraph:
We collect certain device and network connection information when you access the Service. This information includes your device model, operating system, keystroke patterns or rhythms, IP address, and system language. We also collect service-related, diagnostic, and performance information, including crash reports and performance logs. We automatically assign you a device ID and user ID. Where you log-in from multiple devices, we use information such as your device ID and user ID to identify your activity across devices to give you a seamless log-in experience and for security purposes.
It looks to me that they are using it to identify the user uniquely, maybe also related to captcha to prevent bots (it’s common practice to capture mouse and keyboard while resolving captchas to see if the movement is human-like).
Looks like there are more things I need to start randomizing and injecting with noise.
Not exactly. Timing between key presses can be used to identify people.
I am literally so paranoid I regularly vary my keysteoke rhythms and explore polyrhytmic techniques to create variations. Not even joking.
lol no. only the sounds of the keys can identify the keyboard’s model
The goal is not to identify keyboard model. The goal is to identify person. And people tend to have something called habbits.
the chance of this is almost zero. if you are a dangerous cybercriminal, they will track your device down by a networking solution, wait until you leave it unattended and install a hardware-based spy device and capture evidence. No fbi agent will fuck around with keyboard sounds or movie bs like that
with keyboard sounds
Ok, I see you are intentionally going in circles.
Yes.
Not usually. Keystroke info is different than text input, like if you didn’t click onto any field and typed it would only be captured if keystroke are all being grabbed. It’s especially scary if you keep the app running in the bg and then type something and it still captures it. Not saying they’re doing that, but the privacy policy says they might.
The rhythm part is annoying, it’s commonly used to ID people even through things like ad blocks and dns blocks. Could also (in theory) be used to capture what people are typing just by hearing how they type.
If you think the American companies do anything different you’re not paying attention and simply believing the propaganda.
Chinese company does what American companies have done for 25+ years now!
Is it time for REAL data privacy laws or are we just gonna keep playing whack-a-mole with Chinese tech companies that get us nowhere?
It’s a chinese company, where else would they store the data?
The balls.
Antarctica, clearly.
I think its called a data lake, so they don’t “store” it, its rather floating around there 🤪
These lakes are formed when the cloud is saturated and gives us data precipitation.
thanks for the great picture 👍
so here is the current cloud clima forecast:
The saturated clouds will rain into the data lakes that are already overspilling here and there into the ransomstreams already taking all soil in their way with them. During the day there will be security clouds preventing from visible rain only while during the night those same security clouds rain themselves all collected data to their homelake while their homelake security already is corrupted and spills over regulary.
As soon as the fort-cisc-pal-ocstricken-redm-ondams breach it’ll gonna have floods with multi-exabyte waveheights and the ripples of the release will be felt over to far east china and the currents will circulate around the world multiple times causing damage and devastation in their wake around the world and eventually even reach connected orbit.
The floods will have the potential to also wash away and /or drown or choke all the big tech dinosaurs. Only small foss mammals and deep sea amphibics will survive this historic event.
… you kinda asked for it 😉 same as “they” kinda asked for it too. 🤔
At least its not stored on american servers.
I feel like Meta could do a ton more damage with my information than Tencent
This article is what US propaganda looks like folks. Mashable should be ashamed.
Literally all AI companies do this to run their services. Except you can actually download Deepseek and run it completely securely on your own devices. You know who doesn’t allow that security? OpenAI and the other US companies currently being screwed.
every google site has been doing this for years too. every comment we write in youtube and discard before posting, its being recorded. this isnt news at all.
Same as Chrome’s magic bar, or android keyboard no ? So in the end, does USA doing it good because “democracy” (never ever with napalm) when China is bad because human rights violation (USA never did anything like this) ?
Seriously this. Nothing that China is accused of doing is any worse than what i know America has done. If it’s the Chinese Communist Party stealing your data at least you know it won’t be used to inject ads everywhere you go on the internet
At least they’re transparent about it, unlike american companies that hide behind convoluted terms of services and then sell the data behind your back but it’s technically legal.
China’s like “yeah we collect everything”. I can appreciate the honesty.
Nope, At least we can check DeepSeek’s source code
Unlike OpenAI… oops I meant ClosedAI
