Today we’re very excited to announce the open-source release of the Windows Subsystem for Linux. This is the result of a multiyear effort to prepare for this, and a great closure to the first ever issue raised on the Microsoft/WSL repo:
Today we’re very excited to announce the open-source release of the Windows Subsystem for Linux. This is the result of a multiyear effort to prepare for this, and a great closure to the first ever issue raised on the Microsoft/WSL repo:
Don’t you think this is another Embrace, Extend, and Extinguish strategy from Microsoft?
That’s exactly what it is. Any time now you’ll see “the best way to run Linux: on windows” or similar.
Does Lemmy even know what EEE means anymore or are we regurgitating words we heard from some article now?
What’s it going to embrace and extend? WSL has existed for ages and is just a way to run Linux in a convenient container on top of Windows. That’s it. It’s not an attempt to “extenguish” Linux, literally just make the development experience on Windows less painful so people don’t switch to another OS. This has nothing to do with EEE.
Open sourcing it with a permissive license can only be a good thing, and again they’re doing it to be more appealing to devs and maybe get free bug fixes from the open source community. It isn’t some grand conspiracy. But of course this community will react to news of “proprietary blob is now open source” with pessimism.
So either all people of lemmy don’t know shit (you are not included here - implied) or only your assumption is valid: Wrong sources.
It embraces the Linux ecosystem and DX on windows. Microsoft is extending the Linux kernel and other Linux projects.
To you, yes. Can you speak for any project? Is there not a single project where the userbase are consisting of WSL users with compatability issues? Did you research about it? If so, prompt sources.
Trying to bundle the userbase in their subsystem is literally rendering a dedicated Linux machine obsolete. If all would stay there the rest of the distro community would extinguish.
Can it? Contributing substracts work hours from other projects. So “only be a good thing” is wrong. There are more perspectives then just yours.
You got sources about their intentions? You just said it: They are conquering the labor market of personal devs.
Did you already review the code? No concerns left? How about pulling private servers for data? Is everything mirrored onto their servers? Any binary blobs there? Tracking/monitoring? Is it safe in regards of privacy and security?
Hopefully you see that you ain’t holding all answers and opinions of the entire world. Cheers.
Careful now, you’re gonna be called a bootlicker for that lol. Everything Microsoft do is evil according to Lemmings.
You’re 100% right though. People on here regurgitate catchphrases and terms that they heard other people in their echo chamber use without understanding what they mean, and because the person who they heard using it also didn’t know what they meant, it’s just a comedy of incorrect usage of terms.
It’s amazing that people still don’t understand Microsoft’s goals despite them being very open and telling everyone over and over and over - they want to be the defacto solutions on everything, so their stuff needs to run on everything. They will start releasing all of their stuff on linux eventually, because even if only 1% of people use Linux, Microsoft want them using Microsoft services.
I think it’s an attempt to keep people on their platform who need easy access to a unix-like shell. Linux has it and so does mac os. Windows didn’t until they introduced wsl.
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I had to move back to those a few times instead of using WSL during the early days. There were quite a few growing pains.
Fixed it fully by installing Linux.
Ye, and cygwin, mingw and msys are terrible compared to wsl
has, they still work great and keep me sane
MSYS2 is my current choice for GNU/Windows
I think it’s more embrace. They have to compete against so many more entities now.
This is my thought, they’ve all but lost the battle for cloud servers and they’d rather the developers computers were Windows. WSL allows that.
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Yeah but imagine if they could collect licence fees after every AWS server as well.
The world is not enough for these companies.
My client is spending waaaaaaay more money on Microsoft Online than it ever used to on software licenses. Every single user in the business is costing 🇦🇺$30 per month alone just for their Office suite. That’s before you get to the Azure stuff. Some hosted apps cost over 🇦🇺$1k/month to host in Azure.
Before you go too strongly after Microsoft for charging so much, this is cheaper than what we used to pay for running our own SharePoint, Exchange etc farms as well as the infrastructure required to host websites/database etc. All that has been outsourced to Microsoft Online and saves significant money.
Microsoft is doing very well out of its own cloud fees and can cope with AWS, Google and all the smaller private cloud operations getting some of that action.
I know they are doing very well, trust me, I’ve seen the inside of the beast. It’s not Microsoft either, any megacorp will talk to you in terms of how much they lost by not fully monopolising a market segment.
And that is my point, not that they don’t make insane amounts of money, but that it will never be enough.
Azure is enormous, what are you talking about?
I meant running windows on them, its enormous and its all linux servers. I know you can run windows but it’ll be a tiny fraction.
Microsoft don’t care what you run on azure, just that you’re using azure. In fact running Linux on azure instead of Windows benefits them because it’s more lightweight so their hardware stretches further.
Poorly. WSL is awesome but it’s I/O performance is not at a level which will make developers on bigger projects happy.
I think you’re probably right. Microsoft seems less invested in winning an operating system battle at this point. They’re positioning services and abstractions that care less about the end device’s operating system, more so that they’re at least on that device.
I wouldn’t be surprised we see Microsoft “embrace” Proton and Wine in the next 5 to 10 years as it’s far easier to let “the community” predominantly handle supporting legacy Windows versions that have to handle it themselves.
They can’t suddenly lose that entire OS revenue machine however and would need to transition. But I doubt that Redmond are naive to the disruption Wine and Proton are having and how technical users are starting to jump ship.
Xbox is transitioning to “release on everything”, so their upcoming games will all work on proton (apart from COD etc that have anti-cheat, although wouldn’t surprise me if they make that linux compatible eventually). Microsoft would rather you subscribe to game pass to play their games on Linux than not subscribe to game pass and not give them any money. It wouldn’t surprise me if they eventually released a Linux Xbox app.
Normally I would say yes, but WSL is so incredibly necessary for a developer that it might be legit.
It’s not necessary. I’m a full stack developer and I only use it for docker, which isn’t even necessary as you can use docker without it.
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It’s kind of the opposite in my mind, WSL is (was) Microsoft capitulating to the fact that Linux is not going away, same with Azure. WSL is mostly for companies. Some companies have a huge contract with Microsoft and manage all laptops with it. Then they grow big enough that they can’t ignore Linux because they have people who need to work on Linux. WSL is the way Microsoft keeps their clients, because otherwise they move to Apple based IT.
EEE would have been investing in PowerShell, PuTTY, or similar.
What do you mean azure was a capitulation to? The Internet?
Docker doesn’t exist in a usable state on Windows, so its an attempt to allow management of servers using Windows, as Windows Server fades away from usage entirely.
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That was 30 years ago, you’re going to have to move on one day.
No real reason to extinguish here, Microsoft is a services company and can offer those services on Windows and Linux.
I’d wager you’re more likely to see an official compatibility layer on Linux supported by Microsoft before you see them move to extinguish.
💯
Surprisingly few seem to understand the difference between 90s Microsoft and Satya’s Microsoft. Under Satya Microsoft have completely transformed into a services company who aim to have their services run everywhere on absolutely everything. MS services on Linux is coming. Some people still can’t believe that Xbox games are releasing on PlayStation despite it being telegraphed for years.
EEE isn’t a thing they want to do anymore. They want to embrace every platform so they can dominate that market too - not by extending and extinguishing, but by being a one stop shop that no one else can match.
It could be another Embrace, Extend, and Extinguish strategy from Microsoft, because if the increase in Linux user share leads to an increase in malware, most of those users aren’t experts.
So there will be an increase in antivirus software for Linux, but that will also lead to DRM in Linux, and Linux may become what I swore to destroy. While BSD distributions, Redox OS, and other systems take over to become the new Linux as it was in its beginnings.
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It’s a full rewrite in Rust, with no direct relation to the old program.
I wish people would let the EEE meme die. It’s not the 90’s anymore grandpa. Parroting the same pointless meme without applying critical thinking gets old.
Are you suggesting an alternative motive for Microsoft that does beyond profit?
What does that have to do with the price of tea in China? Maybe don’t just toss around non sequiturs.
The profit is getting nerds on the internet to fix bugs in wsl for free