I don’t know what’s going on with the pedophiles, but I hope the same reform.
Is this Pope good?
I am a Gen-Xer who was raised Catholic in America. The old-school church values of my childhood in the 1970s were mostly liberal democratic, promoting humility, circumspection, and Golden Rule, love-thy-neighbor attitudes. (Setting aside the entire organization’s liability for the systematic raping of children, that is, which is a lot to ask.)
But with the more extreme politics of groups like Opus Dei, the modern Catholic Church in America, by contrast, has become a right-wing propaganda machine. It promotes a noxious brand of pseudo-religious pomposity and holier-than-thou windbaggery, practiced by preening, empty-headed bigots and jackasses who couldn’t find real spirituality if it bit them in the ass.*
*Just my opinion, but I’m fucking right.
I don’t see why you would call any catholic leader “Trump loyal”. Trump has nothing to do with this (isn’t he supposed to be protestant btw?).
What’s happening is the Vatican apparently trying to clean itself up a bit. Not really sure if there is anything to expect from it but it’s a start.
It’s a pretty accurate descriptor of some catholic leaders unfortunately, including some who were outspoken and trying to whip up their followers with lies about the 2020 election.
https://www.cnn.com/2021/01/19/opinions/catholic-clerics-who-backed-trump-big-lie-moses/index.html
And yes it is a weird situation. Especially since Biden is actually the catholic candidate.
I am glad the Vatican is trying to clean house a bit though. Some of the people being removed by Francis are those in the articles above, like Strickland.
I understand some clerics did back Trump. It just seemed a bit weird to use this as the main qualifier here. But your point about some of them being removed stands, fair enough.
Totally get you. And he’s certainly taken many anti corruption actions that have nothing to do with Trump or America too.
The Catholic subreddits were filled with bile filled people praising Trump and wringing their hands at othering the queer community. Honestly one of the worst places I saw when I was on reddit.
For most Catholics, abortion is the only issue that exists, so that’s not surprising.
Religious conservatives are a breed apart that is for sure …
Yup. They would nakba the fuck out of everyone here on Lemmy given the slightest opportunity. They’re dangerous af.
Taking into account the Pope had to outright fire a bishop in Texas because he went full MAGA (including speaking at Trump supporter rallies trying to overturn an election result), I wouldn’t say he doesn’t have anything to do with it.
What I meant is that this is purely a power struggle within the Church. The main matter is not Trump but mostly loyalties within the Catholic church. That some bishops are insane enough to support people like Trump is a symptom (and a rather telling one) but not the dividing line here.
This pope is less awful than your average cardinal… the catholic church is so fucking conservative that the pope is still extremely conservative when measured against normal people.
I’m not Catholic; I’m an athiest. But I think this pope is a smart, decent person at the top of one of the world’s largest, wealthiest, old, and conservative organizations, with simply legendary levels of internal politics. He’s one of the most liberal popes we’ve ever seen, ever - although, we’re talking about the Catholic church, so “most liberal” only goes so far. But I do think he’s behaved like a kind, inclusive person.
I suspect any lack of real cleansing of corruption and pedophilia has been due to politics and realpolitik in the church, and not because he approves of it.
Even if he could mount an internal inquisition today, he doesn’t seem like a Pope who would.
Don’t read to much into it. This is a pure publicity stunt to slow down the rate of people leaving the church. But they don’t change at their core. In a few years from now we will find out about all the abuse and dirty businesses going on right now that the Pope and the rest of the Catholic Church is sweeping under the rug as we speak.
They have done similar publicity stunts before. Pope Francis was preaching tolerance and acceptance of homosexuality as far back as 2013. Did things really improve since then?
I see it the same way as Nestle announcing some kind of charity or “commiting” to some kind of sustainability. Yeah sure it does some good but they only do it to hide all the bad stuff.
That’s a very black and white view. There are good comments in this thread, but yours is not among them.
Living in any era, to some extent, comes with a handful of pressures to uphold ideals considered becoming of that era. For better or worse, that includes spiritual leaders from thousands of years ago who lived in what they considered more fertile norms.
During the early Roman empire, the pope and infamously even Jesus had to watch his step with the officers. Today the EU exists where Rome once stood (if we’re not arguing the EU is in fact Rome’s new manifestation) and the pope again must bend or be broken.
This is just removing the previous Pope’s cronies. There’s nothing in the article to make me think the Pope is putting in systemic fixes to prevent his own cronies from worming their way into positions from which they can abuse their power.
I would expect any pope or leader to remove those around him who are loyal to someone else.
I wonder if anyone on the planet has enough brains to get that loyalty actually is something bad… everywhere you go it is praised like the literal best thing in the world but actually if we all were completely disloyal and only subscribed to our values, we might actually get somewhere.
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