Uh oh.
Big uh oh. We had a good run though
Did we tho
Yeah, discord was very fun in its early days until 2020 and covid. 😆
Discord is just another social media site that has a whole lot of people fooled into thinking it’s not creating profiles on them for advertising. Gonna get real obvious real soon though.
I guess thats OK for community dev teams and stuff - like it works well, users can come and accesa the faq or support and leave. But it can leave a walled garden of data in there if they want to move elsewhere later though.
Larger issue is the people that share their whole lives there as a quasi-Facebook. That’s all getting hoovered up and sold to the highest bidder - alongside data like exactly what activity you do on your PC (processes running when and where for how long etc - Discord monitors a lot)
Uh oh.
they’re gonna make it a million times worse putting the activision blizzard guy in charge.
fyi discord has already been enshitifying for at least 5 years now
Discord ruined what was left of online forums and so it’s users now deserve the full force of enshittification. It was so easy to join, how come it’s this hard to leave?
It’s hard to leave because it’s easy to join, and because it has the critical mass of users. Simple as that. It takes a lot to get people to abandon their chats, their friends, their groups, and the years of built-up message history, for an app that likely has fewer users and fewer features.
I don’t want more apps, I want to return to
monkeearly 2000s web forums.Granted they’re not the growing and bustling places they used to be, but there are still both niche and “lifestyle” forums that are alive and stable. Other than this place, one of the latter is where I spend most of my online socializing time.
Mutual hostage taking, you can’t leave because everyone is there, and they can’t leave because you’re there.
Only collective action can be organized to break this social trap. The easiest way is to require the garden’s walls pulled down.
But I’d be fine putting down the executive
Yea I saw the writing on the wall years ago. Why do I want a fucking client to talk to mass people. That is a shit format for more than like 6 people in a room.
It’s basically an old school chat room at that point.
Exactly, and a terrible informational forum IMO
Where the fuck are we gonna go?
You could go to matrix
I dunno. There’s probably a discord group that discussed it but you are not in it so I guess you won’t ever know.
Element. If you are missing something, talk to all those motivated people doing Discord bots or whatever, they can contribute to Element/Matrix. And it’s actually open source, they keep their contributions, contrary to all the work they have done for Discord for free.
Forums. Lemmy. Group Chats.
What does discord do that these dont bar create a barrier for use?
Unlike Forums discord exists.
Voice chat and screen sharing
I’ve got that in my group chats in Telegram but since we should all be moving to FOSS and decentralization, have you considered setting up Jitsi? It integrates with Matrix too. That already pretty much gets you most discord functionality that people care about.
Like a phone call? Group voice chats? I would have thought tis was built into consoles and services, seems odd that Twitch doesnt have this feature.
I have only ever seen it used as a terrible forum clone where discussion sucks and security is poor.
Like a phone call? Group voice chats?
Yep, or even a watch party (group voice chat with someone sharing his screen). You can’t do that on forums or lemmy.
Not sure about twitch, I only use that to watch streams, never to do streams.
IRC is basically all the chat portions of discord.
If you think everyone using the Discord/Slack/Mattermost/Rocketchat/… generation of chat with inline image display and all those features, voice and video chat and screen sharing is ever going to switch to IRC at this point you are simply delusional.
Oh, I don’t expect it to happen, I’m just pointing out that it still exists and takes care of some of that functionality. I don’t think I’ve ever seen gifs, videos, or screen sharing implemented in IRC.
Better though because you don’t need an account, and can gain a lot of anonymity via an eggdrop or vpshell etc.
its gonna enshittify
Let’s be real, the enshitification started quite some time ago. Though I do expect it to get much worse.
Yeah, you are not even paying for minutes yet
Once Discord enshittifies, lazy devs won’t be able to say “follow our Discord for updates!” anymore.
Lol “once Duscord enshittifies”. Bro… It happened years ago.
It was never good from the start, as a voice chat program, it’s miles behind ts3 and mumble, never liked discord, isn’t that what gamer pedo’'s use to get in contact with younger kids anyway?
Idk why you’re being downvoted since everything you said was right.
I think it just got popular because younger gamers don’t know how to use computers, and Discord was easier to use than everything else. The client also looks much nicer than mumble, and overall has better on boarding. The mumble homepage for example looks like a developer site.
Nah, it was pretty good when I used it some years back. I stopped using it before all of the nonsense people are complaining about, so at least for me I have a pretty positive perception. I even pushed to use it at work, which was awesome for productivity until my boss (the CEO) switched us to Slack, which was still decent, but a little crappier than Discord at the time.
I don’t know how it is currently because I actively avoid it for a variety of reasons, but it was pretty good at the time.
lol what, Discord enshittified years ago.
I’m a lazy dev and want to get ahead of this, where should I post my updates?
Back in ye olden days you’d have your own website, a blog, or maybe a forum. It was indexable on Google and anyone could see and interact with your updates. If not for that there’s always steam.
Pfft we got rid of that yonks ago, now you just have to have an AI rewrite your documentation as a million shitty tutorials that are all search-engine optimised on different websites and hope the user finds one semi-legible.
It’s a piece of piss, literally.
On whatever platform(s) you sell your games. The key is not expecting someone to sign up for a different service for your updates.
rss?
Email group
…bluesky?
Hopefully they move to element
Hopefully they just post updates on the platforms they sell their games on. I shouldn’t need to sign up for anything else.
Anyone remember websites and RSS? Those were the days.
Why does everything have to get shovelled into someone’s walled garden…
(Speaking about updates and notifications here, not discussions.)
It’s the walled garden thing that gets me. At some point, people got complacent. I’m 100% confident that there is an entire swath of the population which has never considered that Discord is a corporate entity with corporate interests. We made open standards for a reason.
Everyone I know is like this. They love the corpos because their stuff is shiny and easy, and shoved in their face so they don’t have to learn anything. They have no clue how to use anything that isn’t Apple music, discord. Instagram, Snapchat etc. All garbage.
Hard agree. Mindsets stuck in 2005 or before when cool and useful stuff was, just, free online. We were such summer children then.
Anyone still like that obviously shouldn’t be in charge of anything sharp or dangerous…
Bring the internet back to 03 please. I beg of you
But remember: the design and initial implementation of the internet was paid for by the populace. It is supposed to be filled with cool and useful, free stuff.
Corporate interests and “web 2.0” have turned it into a weird hellscape of misinformation and targeted advertising. It was not designed for it.
Matrix?
I’m guessing so, since Element is perhaps the most popular Matrix client. There are others though.
Hey bruh u wanna buy nitro bruh. It’s the new shit bruh
What the fuck does Nitro even do, other than give you some useless emoji?
Increased file attachment sizes (10->50->100MB depending on tier, I think).
Cross post emojis from any server you are on.
Cross post stickers from any server you are on.
Higher maximum server count.
One free server boost.
Probably a couple more vanity shit. Yep, entirely laughable business model.
What exactly does a server boost do?
Similar to nitro for a user, but for a server as a whole. At various levels it add features to servers. Bigger files, more sticker slots, Banners, animated server icons, higher quality streaming, more options for invite links and how they appear…
I like it, it’s just extra stuff and nothing essential.
It’d suck a lot more if they gated necessary features behind a paywall
The different tiers are 50mb for basic and 500mb for the full.
The full one also includes:
-
Stream video in 4k at 60fps
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2 free boosts and 30% off all boosts
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Custom profile per server(different name, avatar, etc. for each of if you want)
-
200 server limit
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4000 character message limit
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Custom entry sound(and custom sounds everywhere)
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3x free nitro for two weeks that you can gift to people
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Tons of profile/avatar perks including animated banners, profiles, permanent quest rewards, badges, etc.
-
There’s also some discount in their shop.
-
Now some dipshit is going to ruin it with capitalism
I got nitro for higher audio quality so I could stream background music while running a DnD campaign over discord.
It also increases your streaming resolution and file upload size limit which is quite useful.
It also lets you use emojis from any server in any other server, which isn’t “useful” but is fun and I do it all the time.
For these 3 things I think it’s worth it. It’s worth noting I have a grandfathered Nitro plan that is more features than “Nitro Basic” but less features than the next tier at a cost that’s in between.
The real enshitification I’m worried about is the gradually increasing prevalence of ads in increasingly prominent places.
I got nitro for similar reasons but would up cancelling when discord sent ads to a friend of mine with my screen name on it, “why not join your friend _____ with nitro” or something.
Absolutely not, don’t use my name to shill to people I respect.
Where am I moving my friends group? Revolt is nice but not quite ready for primetime / getting a rewrite, and I’ve always been iffy about matrix. Is a signal group chat literally where we’re heading to!?
What’s wrong with matrix/element? We started running our own server for our household group chats and it has been solid.
Why iffy about matrix? You could always use mumble or teamspeak still
As someone who runs a Mumble server (and has for over a decade) – it’s really not a replacement for the user experience that is Discord.
People want a unified UI, the ability to create communities with some amount of customization, embedded/live content, plus voice and video so they can chill and play games together. Mumble is just voice, and while it’s a very good implementation of that, it’s not even in the same user space as Discord.
Matrix does have all of that, though? Except for voice.
I use matrix/element for socializing and Mumble for voice chat while gaming.
To respond to each comment:
- Element is a unified UI, available on PC/Web/Mobile.
- Starting and managing a community involves hitting the + button, creating a community, creating rooms in that community, then setting permissions and ACLs - pretty similar to discord, though with more control as you own the server.
- Embedded content is possible through the embed button.
- Video and voice work, but aren’t great for gaming (see below).
Element Call (aka the new MatrixRTC spec) is great for video calls, but leaves a lot to be desired for chatting while gaming.
Matrix has moved very very slowly and I’m concerned it’ll have the same fate as XMPP, where it’s a bunch of very complicated standards, with maybe one compliant implementation that nobody wants to work on.
I also don’t think it’s a particularly good protocol design for a Discord replacement, it’s not federated it’s a distributed message protocol, which is an order of magnitude more complicated and intensive than potential alternatives.
That said, many non-perfect things have achieved widespread success, so I’m at least hopeful that Matrix/Element are able to catch on in a wider capacity.
Matrix doesn’t have multiple standards, it only has the one? Certain servers expose older API endpoints for backwards compatibility with old clients, but that’s all. The spec is standard and relatively stable.
Likewise, it is very much a federated protocol - dunno where you got the idea that it isn’t.
But, yeah, spec changes do take a while to get accepted/implemented.
Standards as in parts of the spec, as you said in the original reply:
the new MatrixRTC spec
Which is a fork of the WebRTC protocol and another “standard” on top of the REST HTTP protocol.
I should have been more specific with my language, it is federated, but specifically messages (events) are a distributed DAG, and I find the Matrix protocol overly generic for a replacement for something specific like Discord.
The end goal of Matrix is to be a ubiquitous messaging layer for synchronising arbitrary data between sets of people, devices and services
While matrix/element is still very much in development, it is improving constantly. A year ago i sometimes had issues with desynced encryption keys and now that never happens anymore. There is now a modern group call and screensharing system and the new ElementX mobile app which is much faster than the old app. Now there is also OIDC and in a few weeks QR code login will be released, so no more manually entering login and encryption key verification stuff.
QR code login is technically out, you just need to be running your own homeserver (and MAS) to use it.
But, yeah, exciting to finally have that.
You’re right, it has been released, but matrix.org and most other servers either havent activated QR login or arent using MAS. It will be sick tho, the demos make it look very fast and smooth.
SMS/RCS
We need a decent replacement for this, stat. Once they go into IPO mode it’s gonna get real shitty, real fast.
Mumble?
This is them going into IPO mode.
Matrix is a reasonable replacement.
Matrix is still pretty jank
teamspeak are also stepping up their game ive heard
The comeback. I paid for a teamsorak server when I was a teen and used it extensively with friends for many years. As I got older I have only used discord a handful of times to talk to other people already on that platform. Discord has always sucked Imo, if it’s free you’re the product. That’s how it always has been.
I hope it gets even more shit so people will leave the platform.
Sorry, what is a IPO ?
Initial Public Offering.
Its where a company offers stock for public sale, and gets listed on the stock market.
Generally this corresponds with a company pushing hard to maximize profits over other metrics like user growth.
Thank you
Revolt?
It’s open source too.
We already have TeamSpeak/Ventrillo, and I think IRC is still a thing?
Matrix for chatting, when we need voice chat we use ts3. Been using it for so long now, I don’t understand the problem why people dont use it
You can integrate Jitsi to your Matrix too. If you have a client that supports it, you get both chat and voice in the same place.
We need fast voice chat though, i play tournaments for cs2 and apex legends. Haven’t tested jitsi speed yet vs ts3 or mumble, which was the main reason we never used discord to start with
I must admit I’ve never reamly benchmarked any voice chat application. One advantage Jitsi does have is the ability to do p2p calls, saving a couple dozen milliseconds of transfer time compared to going through the server. But how fast is the software itself? No clue.
Oh wow, it can get shittier?
I already left, enjoy it for me.
Bro got replaced by some ex-Activision-Blizzard MBA zombie. Humam got 86’d/golden parachuted from Blizzard after only <2 years as “Vice Chairman”. Then a 1-2 yr gap.
Humam about to get another massive bag once labor force is cut, platform further enshittified, and corp books are sufficiently cooked/prepped for IPO.
Humam - like human, but not really.
Rob Zombie: More Humam than hu-man! He left Activisiioooonnnn!
Kind of like how Marcus Persson was almost a person?
There guess the chat app.
Wait, there’s actually humans working at Discord? I thought the entire thing was run by bots.
“working” lol. He’s the founder and CEO, he collects most of the money.
A bitter end for this lemon.
Is it really bitter if IPO is successful? Citron and other cofounders likely setup to get a massive payout when it IPOs.
Humam isn’t someone that will look after the company for many years. He is brought in to cook the books, and get it to an IPO.
What is success here? The few founders and VC get filthy rich as the larger population dumps their money into Discord stock while the users and teams with limited foresight, who’ve moved their communities to discord, suffer?
I mean yeah I guess that’s the success Cory Doctorow warns us about again and again.
But that’s not my definition of success.
For context I’ve been on the receiving end of an IPO and the founders and investors made out like bandits while a fair number of employees were stuck holding the bags thanks to lock-ins, dilution and over priced shares.
Welcome to enshittification.
Citron means lemon in various languages.
Maybe he was out of juice
