Huh. I never even considered the possibility of putting SteamOS on a laptop/desktop… I have a spare engineering laptop sitting around, might try it.
I completely advocate for it. It costs you nothing but time and disk space. You can still run games from other sources with only slight tinkering.
Open source is so beneficial for humanity and for gaming there aren’t really downsides for tons and tons of games.
You lose all the spyware from microsoft, the incessant mandatory patching and upgrade notifications and loads of other things that provide no value.
Nothing stops you from being able to dual boot windows or run it in a VM either.
Boots up gaming PC
Windows: “YOU IN DANGER ZONE! NEED WINDOWS 11! BUY NEW PC U SCRUB!!!111”
Load up Steam
Steam: “Hey, I see MS are being assholes - click here to install SteamOS instead”
Reboot PC
Millions of people never run windows again
I’m dreaming but that would be amazing. That would make this the year of the Linux desktop. C’mon GabeN, make it happen!
Are you sure you don’t want to create a microsoft ID? Microsoft believes that you should only trust them with all of your data and credentials. They promise they won’t hand over your information to the government unless the government serves them a subpoena or has an agreement to access the data that is lawful or they detect something they have been asked to report.
You forgot the endless pages of trick questions you have to periodically step through to get into Windows. One wrong move and you owe Microsoft money every month.
If Linux had better nvidia support I would swap in a heart beat.
AMD’s RT performance is getting quite close to Nvidia. Each generation gets them closer and closer.
CUDA will always be proprietary but there’s a ton of resources being put against alternative solutions.
Things which are holding this back
- Collaboration with OEMs to provide SteamOS OTTB (Lenovo is an exception)
- Nvidia support. Most gamers use Nvidia GPU unfortunately
- Certain industry-standard software which don’t have a Linux port. PSA: Most people don’t want to learn alt software. Johnny Mainstream is scared of new softwares. This cannot be changed
- End-users suffer from choice paralysis and Linux offers endless choice. Maybe SteamOS can help.
What we know so far, SteamOS won’t be a general purpose OS, so it might not support every random piece of h/w.
We might not have the year of the Linux Desktop, but we can expect 2025-2026 to be the year of the Linux handheld.
SRC: Linux fanboy for the last decade
Nvidia works flawlessly in my system, didn’t have to tweak anything.
Choice paralysis is a surprisingly big issue. I’m waiting for the parts for my new gaming PC build to arrive, and the amount of time I’ve spent choosing a distro has been asinine.
But I did make the choice to leave both the NVIDIA and Windows eco systems on my desktop after seeing most my games run fine on the steam deck ( along with disliking windows 11, and NVIDIA ending gamestream support)As the saying goes, you have to use arch or you have a small penis
Hey! Some of us manage both.
Does anybody remember Wubi? It was Linux that was installed on Windows just like a regular program. Gave you an option to choose Linux on boot. It didn’t make any partitions, and if you didn’t want it anymore? Then you’d go to Windows and uninstall like any other program. It had a few limitations but was an interesting concept.
Of course! It’s what got me started!
I love it as a concept, and frankly a dual boot installer (create partitions) that worked from Windows would be pretty useful I think. USB/disk installs add complexity that just hurt the chances.
Yeah, I remember Wubi! That was 20-ish years ago now. It kind of got made irrelevant by VM’s I guess. I wonder if it’s still around.
VMs are still slow unless you’re talking linux on linux with KVM
Wubi was great because you got native speed to test Linux with, which was probably better than Windows for at least most versions of Windows.
There’s WSL now in Windows 11 - a built-in, pretty performant instance of Linux. The recent versions run a proper Linux kernel I believe (the older ones were more of a compatibility layer over Windows APIs). I’m not sure what the limitations of WSL are. But there is already some kind of Linux in Windows. I use it for the odd utility and to avoid having to learn PowerShell.
There is. Wubi was more about giving 14 year old me the confidence to try out an entirely different os.
That would be a massive headache because you’d have to make it work on any hardware. And if you bork your users’ PCs you’re in for a really bad time. It would be much better to come up with a new Steam machine.
i mean… any hardware is kinda just a matter of time imo
linux already works with more hardware than windows does, and often more reliably - not some of the complex stuff required for gaming of course, but again… matter of time. it’s not important until it’s important and then it really kicks off
Big old citation needed there.
Supports more hardware… But not gaming hardware… And not industrial hardware which is often windows only… But def more…
“It erased pictures of my nana, Im going to sue Gabe Newell!” Windows users 🙄🙄
(I am that user)
Microsoft recently announced a handheld for Xbox. They’re going to half ass this they way they did with windows phone.
If it ran SteamOS, I’d have died laughing.
Yeah, I don’t think Microsoft has ever understood or cared how much pc gaming has added value to windows.
Which makes the strategic defeat here of failing to understand they are fucked longterm all the more satisfying.
I hope that SteamOS finds more of its way into desktop computers. Sure, I don’t trust Valve; just like I don’t trust any other corporation. But it’s like fighting a big cancer with a smaller meta-cancer, if they hurt Windows/Microsoft I’m happy.
Plus its current relationship with GNU/Linux is symbiotic.
Why is steam/valve bad?
They are a privately owned company with 100% focus on customer service and sustainably.
Yeah they charge like 10% of profit for the games on there, and more if you make it big. To be on the only platform where people actually shop for PC games…
Nobody has ever given me a real problem with Steam where some other company isn’t already doing significantly worse shit in comparison.
30%
Not the only platform
Glorified downloader with DRM
The way I see it, they are the lesser of two evils. Just because someone isn’t as bad a Microsoft, doesn’t mean that they are forgiven for their sins.
Predatory lootboxes, and not cracking down on CSGO Gambling site are the biggest sins which Valve has committed.
Going beyond that, no clear path forward for when the Steam DRM Client goes offline. I personally have games which I bought on legacy hardware, that no longer runs on that hardware since Steam discontinued support for it. I don’t expect Valve to support all hardware indefinitely, however I can buy the same game from GOG, and install it on my XP and Win 7 machines without issue.
I am certain that there are other issues, and compared to MS they look like a saint. But for me I diversify my game library and get as much of my games DRM Free or on a platform which has a proven track record for supporting not just their current purchases but also legacy ones.
Beat Sony with a stick all you want. Despite the PSP being 21 years old this year, if I can connect my PSP to the internet, I can still download my digital PSP PSM and PS1 games.
How would steam crack down on gambling sites they don’t own and trades they don’t know are linked to those sites?
One answer is quite simple. Not to sell loot boxes.
I mean counter strike and team fortress 2 worked fine and were extremely fun games before they added a virtual slot machine to their games. “they’re just skins” right? If they were given out for free in game it wouldn’t impact the rest of the games experience.
Valve can also prevent the sale of real world money for these items. Especially if it’s been flagged for Gambling.
Or as another stated disable or moderate the usage of their own API on these gambling sites.
It uses their API to trade and sell the skins. They are in total control of what happens with them. There are many ways they could stop them, but they don’t want to because it makes them money. They want to be seen acting like they’re trying to stop them, but without actually doing anything impactful.
They could also easily do some analysis of trades and see which accounts are owned by the gambling sites and ban them, and nuke their inventory. They have full access to the data of who traded what when with whom. With some statistical modeling and maybe some fake trades, it’d be easy to figure out. They won’t even try.
They charge 30%, and only goes down after making $10 million in sales.
But Sony, Nintendo, Microsoft charge just as much.
Every other game storefront has been like “But Valve doesn’t even do anything! We’ll cut them out and then we’ll make so much more money!” And then they force you over to their own garbage storefront that has none of the features of Steam, has a smaller selection of games and demands equal space in your system tray at all times.
They’re only undercutting Valve cause they wish they could be the monopoly taking 30%
Don’t get me wrong I think 30% is bullshit, but it’s an industry thing not especially a Valve thing
I’m generally a fan of Valve (at least historically), but at least recently some stuff has come out about them propping up a billion dollar gambling industry via CounterStrike skins. It’s full of legal loopholes to avoid being classified as actual gambling, thus allowing underage users to get addicted to casino mechanics. This might actually be Valve’s current biggest profit center in recent years.
Remember when Google’s motto was “don’t be evil”? Remember when Facebook was innovative? Remember when [insert any post-IPO platform] was privately owned?
Look at the past and future, not just the present. Corporations eventually go sour, and fight against the very users that they were supposed to serve. Give Steam/Valve enough power and it’ll do the same. We don’t need corporations serving us software; we need open systems.
That said Valve is situationally useful here because it’s eroding Microsoft’s power.
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That’s how publicly traded companies work, profits above all else.
Good thing Valve isn’t publicly traded!
Post-IPO? Valve is privately held. Which is why they make strategic decisions that stakeholders would never approve of.
I think you’re both right really. I don’t trust Steam the company I trust Gabe Newell the person. Once he’s retired or passed on they could easily go ipo and begin enshittification.
I mentioned IPOs as an example of things making a company take a 180°, from “we luuuv customers!” to “customers are things to be milked, not humans to care about”. There are a thousand other possibilities - being bought by another (and more abusive) corporation, being inherited by arseholes and/or fools, or even a change in the mindset of its current owners.
There’s absolutely nothing preventing all those shitty outcomes. Nothing. And when one of them happens, the suckers who “buy” games through the platform - including myself, and probably you - will be shown a middle finger, and hear a moronic “ackshyually u didn’t buy the games lol you licensed them lmao”.
You can’t trust it.
They did help usher in the age of microtransactions and lootboxes with their CS and TF2 stuff. That’s about the only major bad thing I can think of that they haven’t been particularly apologetic about.
Yeah they charge like 10% of profit for the games on there, and more if you make it big.
Which is the same as the vast majority of every other store (video game or otherwise). It’s really only a factor because Epic keeps bringing it up as a reason they’re better than Steam, and should be allowed to be the monopoly instead (though they don’t explicitly state that part).
Wasn’t it more mobile gaming that had a bigger impact on mtx and loot boxes with games there having consumers less willing to pay more than 99 cents at the time and having to rely on the freemium model as well as having an enormous user base with the accessibility of smartphones?
I keep hearing tf2 and cs go but maybe it’s because I got into PC games late, but had no clue about loot boxes. And average gamer or last least the younger ones grew up playing consoles and then mobiles games more than PCs at the time aside from PC only games like league of legends, cs, and so on.
It was 100% mobile gaming that ushered in the age of microtransactions.
Yeah, I don’t think lot of gamers realize just how huge the mobile gaming market is and how influential it is with other companies following trends of proven money makers.
Like Apple ranked third in gaming revenue with 15.3 billion in 2021, and traditional gamers wouldn’t think of Apple when it comes to gaming.
You give too little credit to horse armor.
Mobile gaming was the major factor, definitely, but it was far from 100%.
Yes, it was more mobile gaming, but that doesn’t mean Valve had no hand in it at all. It certainly had a huge impact on desktop variations of it.
That doesn’t mean they’re wholly evil or some other bullshit like that, because of it, but their hands are definitely not clean of it.
Consoles were and still are more mainstream than PC with some companies claiming PC gaming is dying for so long that is took a long time for other companies to start giving a go at a storefront on PC.
I just don’t really buy the Steam factor, since most people’s exposure to mtx, iap, and in game ads has been through mobile gaming. Like if they don’t even play CS or TF2 they don’t even know about it at all which would be someone like me, but mobile gaming has been so easily accessible that even “non gamers” like old people were sucked into stuff like bejeweled.
Most games have also been console ports to PC than the other way around too. Steam and PC emergence has felt like more a recent thing that started taking hold last gen with companies finally coming around to porting stuff to PC.
That’s not to say they haven’t had a hand in it, but it seems overstated with rise in the freemium model across platforms being the main driver. Even the concept of gacha existed before video games.
I guess I don’t really get where you’re coming from. Are you saying that, because you don’t feel that PC gaming was important in your lifetime that decisions Valve has made don’t really make any difference? That even if they had made anti-customer decisions, that it wouldn’t really matter because “PC gaming is dying”?
Hell, a major reason some companies claim that is because of valves dominance on PC. They don’t want to admit that they don’t have as much control, so they do their best to dismiss it as a non-issue…
Which is really neither here nor there about the entire point I was making in the first place. At no point did I say that they were the spearhead or major push… just that they helped. Just because something doesn’t do 90% of the work doesn’t mean they made no impact at all, and that decisions they made have no moral or ethical emphasis. The point was that Valve is not some pristine god from the heavens sent down to cleanse our filthy gamer bodies. They’re a company like any other, who occasionally make missteps. Valve just tends to make more consumer friendly choices than most.
gambling (both lootboxes and the skin site kind), big fees
Industry standard fees, actually.
Epic is the outlier, and only because they want to seem like the good guy. If they had market dominance, they’d charge just as much, if not more.
How would steam crack down on gambling sites they don’t own and trades they don’t know are linked to those sites?
They could easily block the APIs the gambling sites are using to operate, but they’ve just sent some cease and desist letters to a few instead and have continued to take their cut of all trades.
I think they charge 30% but yeah.
100% focus on customer service
Lol
Trust the Gabe
Steam needs to drop a whole OS for PC.
https://store.steampowered.com/steamos/buildyourown
You can install it yourself on PC.
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Note that the SteamOS download on that page is NOT the current version of SteamOS used on the Steam Deck, it’s the 2-3 year old version that Valve released a while back and doesn’t have most any of the actual improvements to SteamOS that make it worthwhile. The only way to get the current SteamOS is to download the recovery image for the Steam Deck at https://help.steampowered.com/en/faqs/view/1B71-EDF2-EB6D-2BB3 and install from there.Linus from LTT did a video about getting it up and running here: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tdR-bxvQKN8
EDIT: As per usual, Linus didn’t do good research and was incorrect about the SteamOS version available at that link, updated to strike the incorrect info.
Seems like the instructions are still for SteamOS 2, they mention a file named “SteamOS.zip” while you get a file bzip archive of an img file
Yeah, Linus didn’t actually bother clicking the links. The old OS download links redirect to the arch based steam deck os
Yeah, Linus didn’t actually bother clicking the links.
Ya know, somehow I’m not surprised to hear LTT didn’t do their research
Why anyone ever watched their garbage videos is beyond me.
I’d like to think they provide a useful service. “useful” as in entertaining and a sense of community. They get things wrong but I’d like to think that they try and in the “churn” of making videos and running a company you screw up every now and again.
I haven’t watched an LTT video in a while though. I just hate their thumbnails (I get the algorithm forces them) but over time I think their content just isn’t for me, but I can see why others would.
It’s entertaining.
Tbf, I only know because I watch too much YouTube and bringus studios mentioned it a couple months ago.
Bringus needs more love around these parts
Or it was filmed before Valve updated the info on the page
Nope, been like that for months.
Eta: it was mentioned in a bringus studios video a couple months ago, iirc installing steam on a cardboard box
Interesting, I looked into it about 6 months ago and all the info was not to use the link so maybe they didn’t go on the page because everyone was saying not to 🤷
Yeah 6 months sounds about right from my recollection. It was available for a while after they released the steam deck, and something like 6-8 months ago they started redirecting to the deck os instead.
They were talking about SteamOS 2.0 being Debian and made for general hardware and SteamOS 3.0 being Arch based and really only meant for the Steam Deck, though it’s unclear if there’s drivers enough to put it on other hardware, but we’re looking at Powered By SteamOS devices coming out. So, am I to take it that SteamOS 3.0 is implied to be capable of installing on alternate hardware now?
Like, I’m just going to stick with my Steam Deck but it’s interesting to think you can make Steam Machines again.
To be fair it’s not exactly obvious that the downloaded file is generic enough to be used on something else than the Steam Deck when the file is named
steamdeck-repair-20231127.10-3.5.7.img.bz2
That’s still steamos2, based on debian 8 (current is debian 12). What’s on the Steam deck is much more recent, usable and stable.
There’s some user made distros that are basically just like steamos3 though, but at that point you may just as well install a mainstream linux distribution and simply install steam on it.
Nope, the download link actually redirects to the arch based steam deck os.
They really need to update the rest of the page… Big ass banner right above the download link says it’s not compatible for the deck, but then the download link is for the deck image you can’t install on a PC.
Lol, I’d be fine with them leaving it as is, if only they’d make a general release of OS3
Same. They alluded to what I am now assuming is this news a while back and I had thought it meant they were updating the desktop version to parity with the deck one. Now I’m just wondering how they can have it work on other handhelds but not all devices. What is their specific distro doing that it can’t have drivers that exist for Linux in general?
Oh, I’d be willing to bet the long wait has something to do with Nvidia drivers.
I switched to arch a couple of months ago and the Nvidia drivers were one of the most confusing parts.
SteamOS 3.0 should get out there for generic PCs pretty soon, in the meantime there’s Bazzite.
It’s in the works. Valve is working to develop SteamOS for other devices, including PC.
https://www.theverge.com/2024/12/6/24315098/valve-steam-machines-steamos-steam-deck-vr
Just install Mint or Bazzite, Steam OS is intentionally locked down more than it needs to be.
If they do it this year, it might finally be the Year of the Linux Desktop!
I hope they bring SteamOS to ARM eventually.
It’d be great, but they haven’t even ported the Steam desktop client to 64-bit x86 yet*, I feel like we’re going to wait a while for that.
* and that’s not even true, they were forced to port it for the Mac, so they’re just sitting on the 64 bit builds for the other OSes for some reason
64-bit brings a lot of benefits - can use more RAM directly, more opcodes and lots more registers allow code to run much more efficiently - but for a programme that I just want to open, click on a couple of times and then for it to be almost completely out of the way, those aren’t the biggest selling points. In fact, definitely supporting 32-bit for older games might be better. They might just not want the maintenance headache of supporting two builds.
Microsoft should go to HR about that lunch.
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This is a dumb headline and a dumb article. Valve is making ripples in handhelds, yes, but to say the same on PC is moot. Microsoft still has an iron grip on a large amount of PCs. There’s so few that will bother with SteamOS as OS of choice since it is a one-trick pony compared to Windows, even though it is shit right now. They still need Windows to run nearly 99% of games.
They still need Windows to run nearly 99% of games.
No you don’t? Literally that’s what proton does
The biggest holdouts are specific kernel anticheat solutions.
honestly steam os is in many ways better at running old ass windows programs than windows.
Case in point, Steel Panthers (WinspMBT or WinspWW2) is an ancient DOS game that can’t run in fullscreen without crashing on Windows and honestly I prefer it on my deck because it inherently runs the game in fullscreen and overall seems to run it better than my windows computer ever did.
99%?
I’d say SteamOS/Linux is closer to running 99% of games. Mostly just anti-cheat standing in the way.
And what does the majority of players use to install and play games? Yes, Steam.
Also 78 of the 100 top games on Steam just run on Linux and 90 with some tinkering. Not really sure where that 99% comes from.
You’re missing the point, while everyone plays on windows, valve makes all the money. Now with handheld valve is looking to own the OS and Marketplace.
In the first one Microsoft gets very little benefit for all the gamin on their OS, in the handheld it’s possible they’ll own nothing.
It is very strangely worded and structured. I mean, the point is fairly obvious and by extension not… wrong, but the analysis and the writing aren’t great.
Which I guess is on par for what’s left of Kotaku these days.
