It never ceases to amaze me how often I still learn about how much stuff is illegal in the US. All I ever heard growing up was how it’s the freedomest country in the world and that the entire concept of its government was built on personal freedoms, and yet it doesn’t even seem to be true on its own terms.
So many conspiracy theories in these comments about why American manufacturers don’t build smaller cars.
It’s very simple, American Auto Companies are loan companies, not auto manufacturers.
Why would they produce a $10k go-kart with a useable bed when they can get people to finance a $110k SUV at 18% APR?
It’s not about oil, or other resources, or even labor and tooling.
It’s just much more profitable to put you into debt.
Especially because we are a captive market. Public transport is essentially non existent in most areas. You have to get a car, and you have to take a loan on it. Without a car, a lot of places won’t even hire you.
you have to take a loan on it.
Can’t you buy cheaper or 2nd hand cars?
It’s still going to be at least $10k or so, unless you scour Facebook marketplace or know how not to get scammed.
My stepfather’s job was to negotiate deals between the car dealerships and the banks. They were all fucking sharks. Used car salesmen are terrible people as a rule.
Yes. It is quite straightforward. First you figure out the kind of car you want - eg, Toyota Corolla or Honda Civic. Peruse fb marketplace / Craigslist / etc to look at your options, note typical price for what you want based on model year and condition. Check your market once per day for a few weeks or months, and eventually a deal will come up - or else you can search in other areas you’d be willing to travel to. When you find a good (or at least reasonable) deal, you message the seller, and tell them the following things:
- You are very interested.
- The earliest time you are available to meet - ideally “right now or any time today”. Also ideally, this would occur during normal business hours for mechanics and banks.
- You can pay in cash.
- You want it inspected by a mechanic before you buy.
When you agree on a time / place to meet, start looking up mechanics nearby. Getting a pre-sale inspection is a service offered by most shops for a small fee. Call ahead and ask if they can do an inspection around the time you are meeting the seller.
Before you meet with the seller, look up a checklist of things to inspect yourself. These are basic things that are easy to check - do the lights work? The blinkers? The AC/heat/defroster? You can find inspection lists pretty easily online.
Meet with the seller. Ask them about the car, its history, maintenance records, and why they are selling it. Take it for a test drive on neighborhood roads and on the highway. Drive to the mechanic and have them inspect the car.
After all this, it is time to negotiate. If you or the mechanic found anything concerning, you can use this to haggle with the seller, who is likely ready to take a few hundred less in order to be done dealing with the headache of selling their car. With an agreed upon price, head to your bank.
Most banks provide members with free notary services. You can have them notarize a bill of sale or the car’s title if necessary. Once the title is signed over to your name, go to the teller, withdrawal cash, and hand that fat stack to the seller.
Drive away with your new car.
Also make sure the shop knows its a pre-sale inspection
I’ve noticed that Americans do not consider using an armed rebellion against evil corporate practices but talk about 2A rights all the time.
but talk about 2A rights all the time.
Most of the 2A talks come from people who want to start evil corporations.
No armed rebellion is complete without a technical built from a Toyota Hilux, which we sadly only get the slightly larger variant, the Tacoma.
The truth about the perfect vehicle for armed uprisings isn’t that they only use Hiluxs. That’s simply a myth. The truth is that no other vehicle has ever been able to complete even a single mission. You send 20 Hiluxs and 40,000 Tacomas into battle? You’ll soon have 20 Hiluxs and 40,000 heaps of burning inferior pieces of junk. The Hilux has proven time and time again that it isn’t just the perfect vehicle for an armed rebellion, it’s the only vehicle able to survive.
And them’s the facts.
As an American I can break it down for you. The people who wont stop about 2A are sheep, sheep get told what to think, so when the “news” tells them that doing anything to make life better in America will actually make life worse and is some form of evil -ism (communism, socialism, etc.) that they have been programmed to hate, they believe it without question. These clowns are incapable of creating a personal opinion, they just accept the narrative that their favorite talking head gives them, and think they came up with it all on their own.
This is without even getting into the tribalism that makes these beliefs they have been given feel like a part of their identity, and thus making it near impossible to change.
I’m not really concerned about these idiots losing their guns, because they’re too much of pussies to actually use them on the correct enemy. They don’t know who the enemy is, let alone be able to read. They’re easily indoctrinated. Not only that, their co-opted, their messages are taken away from them. I mean, they’re just such a servile people. For me, I mean, if there ain’t no revolution, because there ain’t gonna be one inside of the Imperial core, the gun would just be used on myself to kill myself, so I just don’t have a gun. I mean emotions fluctuate, you know?
That sounds more conspiracists than “Americans like shit vehicles”
The Canyonero Simpsons episode came out in 98 to make fun of this
Anyone who cares about american auto manufacturing shouldn’t be taken seriously.
Americans make shit cars.
It depends on your supply chain and the willingness of rich people to take the fair share that they deserve and give the workers the fair share that they deserve. But in America, it’s all about the lowest common denominator. So everything is made terribly. Americans can make better cars, but we don’t. Because we allow rich people to step all over us. Because we have no class solidarity or any goddamn common sense. We fail to see ourselves in the hierarchy. But at the end of the day, capitalism will destroy the planet.
FORD
Fail On Race Day
Not disagreeing with you, but Kei trucks lack a lot of standard safety features, so it’s not a black and white issue
They don’t have standard safety features because it’s illegal to import the ones that do.
So the reason is because it’s unsafe, unlike, oh, idk, the sharp-edged Cybertruck?
…both things can be true?
For the record I’d love to get a Kei truck. But they like… don’t have airbags lol
My point is that the Cybertruck is unsafe, and it’s on the market. So the American car market clearly doesn’t require safety, it’s just a marketing point.
I think we can all agree that Cybertrucks are a bit of an outlier here. I mean we used to ridicule vehicles with safety this poor. But yeah I wouldn’t want to be on the freeway in either a cybertruck or a kei truck. But moving stuff downtown would be perfect for them - basically give them moped permissions.
But yeah I wouldn’t want to be on the freeway in either a cybertruck or a kei truck.
Why not? Because everyone else is in a truck so large they wouldn’t be able to see you?
Not a problem here in Europe. Wiki says they can do 120 ungoverned. Seems fine enough. Large commercial trucks, as in “semis” to Americans, but even the smaller Large Heavy Goods vehicles, as in lorries in Britain, aren’t allowed to do more than 80km/h on the freeway. I’m sure the Kei trucks can do that even when encumbered.
The other huge vehicles are a factor, but you’re fine doing 120 without airbags?
You are missing the point, the cyber truck will kill/maim/damage pedestrians (no biggie), cyclists (no biggie) and other cars (darn, gotta deal with insurance) most of the time! It’s a feature for the kind of people that buy them.
Didn’t Trump start messing around with all that? Like our safety standards? Because his boy, Elon, wanted to be looked at as… The CEO that doesn’t create unsafe cars.
For three years we’ve used this GEM[global electric motors] LSV[low speed vehicle] as our primary vehicle.
Legally I’m restricted to roads with 35mph speed limits or less, my maximum legal speed is 25mph, I never bothered to modify the top speed. I’m registered & insured in Reno. Driving the GEM is like towing a trailer, if the line of cars forms behind me, I pull over & let them pass Maybe 4 times a year someone rage passes me & generally ends up waiting next to me at the next light
With the lumber rack, beacon & safety triangle, I probably appear to be a city or university worker.The notion that everyone must drive at or above the speed limit isn’t true in my experience. Every trip does not require getting on a limited access highway & blasting along at 70 mph. The time saved is minimal, Small mistakes become serious accidents at higher speeds Every vehicle forum I’ve ever been on has a large contingent of Boys who want their toys to go fast.
The older model Kei mini trucks is too short & narrow to go faster than 40 mph or so safely. Making it wider reduces the ability to lane split :DI used to ride my bicycle in a medium sized city and I’d get to the destination sooner because I burned the lights. I know it’s wrong but I did and I would get there before them. It’s funny, people just don’t think about anything really, they just accept society as it is. Clearly we don’t need all these big giant fucking trucks, and I fucking hate it. I think to myself, a lot of these motherfuckers are running their trucks like Halliburton with the beds empty, with a nice coat of wax. They call themselves cowboys, but they’re just goofballs and they look so beta. I mean, unless they’re at like a left-wing protest and they want to drive people over. People get these trucks because they’re fucking scared anti-social fucks. Anybody that drives a monster truck is a douchebag. We are a servile people in America. I look at Europe and I’m envious. The way they protest against things and the government has to listen and the cops are not like full-blown military. I just love it. I just love Europe. It’s just so much better than here. Now, I do understand that the same influences are polluting Europe and Europe is not a perfect place. But I’ve been there and it feels so much better being there. When I went, I specifically set my mind up to look at infrastructure, the health of the people, and all things other than being a tourist, just even how people communicate with each other, looking at families, the food. I didn’t go to fancy restaurants. I went to hole-in-walls. It’s just so much better. It’s so much better of a place. And don’t get me wrong. Europe is suffering because the Yankee was trying to separate Russia and its cheap energy from Europe. And really the leaders of Europe have screwed themselves because now America is turning their backs on them. The Ukraine War was started in 2014 when they… The United States supported a coup and overthrew the democratically elected president of that time. And then the nationalist or fascist ended up gaining more power. And so I guess now the Yankee is supporting the fascist in Ukraine. And we, in the United States, are living under a fascist regime. Biden is an example of the old Neo-liberal order nato fascist and Trump is something new. He is a response to populism. He is a response to capitalism in crisis.He is a fascist, a full-blown fascist. people in America thinking that they’re western civilization, that’s ridiculous. This place is a casino of stupidity. They think the decisions that they make about life are theirs, but in reality, it’s the choices you’ve been given. You have no say in your community, your society, at the end of the day. I don’t need to be hostile. I’m just looking for my opportunity to jet and get the fuck out of this empty vessel of lesser things. If I left, I would never, never, never, ever, ever, ever, never return to America for anything. I would just leave it all. The guilt I feel for America and its choices. Also, I do view this place as.a trap of debt slavery. And this place rewards antisocial behavior. It is truly an abysmal place and it is not just Trump. This is a continuation and Trump is just like, straw that broke the camel’s back for me. I can’t do it anymore. Life ain’t worth living if I gotta stay.i’m sick of the good-caught bad cop scenario. I’m sick of the left and right paradigm. I’m sick of American exceptionalism …i am sick of American imperialism. Either neoliberal soft power or full-blown fucking fascist.
Europe is suffering because the Yankee was trying to separate Russia and its cheap energy from Europe
Cheap oil. Oil is bad. Good it’s gone. Build solar panels instead.
The United States supported a coup and overthrew the democratically elected president of that time
In November 2013, a wave of large-scale protests known as “Euromaidan” began in response to President Yanukovych’s decision not to sign a political association and free trade agreement with the European Union (EU), instead choosing closer ties to Russia. Euromaidan soon developed into the largest democratic mass movement in Europe since 1989.[29] Earlier that year the Verkhovna Rada (Ukrainian parliament) had overwhelmingly approved finalizing the EU association agreement;[30] Russia had pressured Ukraine to reject it.[31] The scope of the protests widened, with calls for the resignation of Yanukovych and the Azarov government.[32] Protesters opposed what they saw as widespread government corruption and abuse of power, the influence of Russia and oligarchs, police brutality, human rights violations,[33][34] and repressive anti-protest laws.[33]
And then the nationalist or fascist ended up gaining more power. And so I guess now the Yankee is supporting the fascist in Ukraine
Colorado’s Division of Motor Vehicles also tried to explicitly ban them last year, though it later pulled its proposed rule. Some kei vehicle owners, however, say the state is still trying to keep them off the road by refusing to allow them into the emissions testing process.
As usual it’s confusion from news when reporting on public policy. So are they proposing that there be exceptions to emissions rules for these vehicles or not? Because that will make a huge amount of difference in how much I or pretty much anyone else should support this.
Should’ve been okay from the start.
But isn’t that the story of America? Making things illegal that would prevent you from maximizing profits to the detriment of every one of your countrymen.
100% agree and an awesome username.
Considering?! Just fuckin’ do it, who does it hurt?
It hurts GM and Ford. They don’t want competition! And worse yet they don’t even build anything to compete with kei trucks! Think of the shareholders, you monster!
Itll hurt the cyber cucks for sure
I don’t think the customers of small, affordable, useful trucks are the same customers as the cybertruck owners.
It takes away more of teslas marketshare. Eventually making it not economically viable to produce them.
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This is an echo back to the 70s, when gas prices were high and there were strict controls over Japanese economy cars. Why didn’t American manufacturers make smaller cars? Well, “no one wanted them” was the line. Miraculously almost as soon as those same Japanese cars started to be allowed on our streets, suddenly Detroit figured out how to make them and dragged them kicking and screaming into the next eras.
Good companies innovate to keep their customers. Bad companies legislate to keep their customers.
Which one do you think is happening more today?
Detroit never made them; they bought them and rebranded them with trim packages.
Here’s news: the US cannot make cars. They only know one style, and that’s land yacht.
American cars were more fuel efficient and size efficient following the 70’s fuel crisis. It wasn’t until the Chicken Tax and Cafe Standards you see the shift from small work trucks to SUVs and large trucks.
This passed a couple days ago and will be signed by the Governor today! Takes effect July 2027.
I would kill for one of these trucks, its so fucking stupid that they are banned
I’d go for it with a slight caveat: They need to uprate the engines a bit so they can cruise on US highways at US highway speeds. While they can reach 75mph ungoverned, you generally don’t want to run an ICE at close to its limit. That’s why you aim for 85-100mph max speed for US highways; it means it’ll be running efficiently cruising at 60-70mph.
Fortunately, this shouldn’t be difficult. The engines would likely be capable of it with a little tuning or extra turbocharger boost. And going electric makes it all a non-issue.
I’d still take one for most stuff. 70MPH is the maximum speed permitted on the majority of the US interstate system, most US highways were limited to 55 until relatively recently (at least in along the East coast).
While you can go slower, you’ll be the slowest vehicle on the road. That’s a safety concern because differences in speed are the most important issue on the highway. The safest speed there is the one where you flow with everyone else.
I drive a K6a turbo engine 5spd manual daily and at 110km/h (~68mph) it’s standing at around 3.5k rpm which is their sweet spot for fuel economy. The red line is at 8k. The car could go hours at that pace without any issue. It’s stock.
Had an aircooled vanagon that was way more picky than my kei car. Driving 55+ mph was a sure way to overheat.
And going electric makes it all a non-issue.
Easier to upgrade, given, but most of the electric versions are on slightly oversized golf cart drivetrains with lead acid batteries.
I’ve seen a few YouTubers unbox them.
If you look for an Indonesian model, some are available with a 1.2 liter engine instead of the Japanese max 600cc.
I would even be happy with a small pickup like the old Datsuns or Mazdas. Instead my choices are Big-ass Toyota Truck or Ford Monster Truck or Dodge Monster Truck.
I have two Ford Rangers which are the US-branded Mazda B2000s. I am SO paranoid about anything going wrong with them because in my market I am FUCKED. I cannot work out of the trucks made after 2012.
Curious, why do you need a small truck?
When I first moved to Los Angeles I was amazed at all the small trucks still being used. NY road salt destroys them so I hadn’t seen any in years. The small Toyotas and Rangers are loved by gardeners and the prices they command show it.
I do carpentry, building, handyman stuff. LOTS of tools and blades and bits and all kinds of shit. I have a canopy on the bed . I made a sliding drawer and I need to pull it out and have all my tools at waist level. I’m watching these clowns having to constantly climb up into their truck beds and dig through packout boxes and it is silly. Also, I can fit into a parking space and not block the Lowes drive-through lumberyard
had a 95 Nissan 240sx. in Japan, it was a little different, called Silvia. drift cars. couldn’t buy but had to be imported/converted to us specs. saw some Chinese trucks also damn useful as farm trucks. fucked that up
ill give you a japanese truck if…
Maybe US car manufacturers could, y’know, make their own compact trucks? 😀
American Auto Manufacturers are run by ancient douche bags that are desperately holding on to the past.
No, they’re run by ancient douche bags that are constantly finding loopholes in the current laws that allow (if not encourage) them to make bigger vehicles.
If they were desperately trying to hold onto the past, the new Ford Ranger reboot wouldn’t be nearly the same size as an F-150.
The only good Ranger was the Mazda B2000.
Capitalists don’t like to compete fairly.
that requires a shift in design and engineering, not to mention retooling the actual manufacturing process
less expensive to just keep selling shit in the status quo. change is effort, effort is waste, waste is less profit margins
they retool for every single model anyway. there’s really no excuse
They don’t have as much profit as large trucks. Capitalism strikes again.
I mean, it’s probably not safe in a crash at highway speeds (if it can even reach those speeds), but then neither are motorbikes and we allow those…
It’s got to be better for the environment and wallet than those stupid Ford monster trucks. Especially since these would only attract people who actually need to carry large amounts of stuff about, rather than those who once needed to transport a fridge four years ago.
They do ok against regular sized cars, just yours are insanely big.
At lower speeds perhaps. But at highway speeds probably not. Remember: You are the crumple zone in those Kei trucks. As an old and now retired Medic and Firefighter, I’m glad I will never need to cut a dead body out of one those things-- I bet it would be a messy and bloody affair. Because while cutting the first one or two wreaks is sort of fun and exciting, it quickly becomes depressing after that and leaves mark that ain’t ever growing back. And I carry enough marks to take to the grave with me.
The acceleration is also poor due to the small low and powered engines. I would not want to try and merge onto a freeway in a metropolitan area in one. And you can bet long money that some suburban weekend warrior Bob Villa wanna be is going to try to do exactly that with the back end loaded with 10 sheets of plywood, 2 dozen 2x4’s, a roll of outdoor carpeting and 8 bags of concrete. And then be super surprised when he becomes a hood ornament for a semi truck rolling along at 60mph or some SUV.
That said, I do think thing such small delivery vehicles have a place in the urban environment. Hell, even a Tuk Tuk, a cheap and popular 3rd world motorcycle taxi/cargo hauler hybrid would be even better yet. They would be excellent for operating on side streets and residential neighborhoods making small deliveries. Just keep them off of high speed roadways. And I’m not sure that’s a solvable problem. Humans being what they are.
I’ve never seen one on a motorway, I’m not 100% sure that they’re allowed, plus in European countries small cars are far more common. We do ok.
We citizens need to change the laws to highly tax those oversized vehicles. And we should make them commercial use only. Average people don’t need huge trucks. K-cars are quite cool.
Unfortunately taxes are kinda the reason why we see so many oversized trucks on the market and the reason you don’t see any small trucks anymore. It’s a result of manufacturers and lobbyists gamifying the EPA regulations that came out like 10-15 years ago.
Basically trucks under a certain weight have to meet a certain mpg standard otherwise they’d be taxed at a higher rate. However, there was a bypass for heavier “super-duty” trucks, so now most every truck being sold is classified as a super-duty which were originally meant to encompass “working” trucks meant to haul things like equipment.
It’s really just another symptom of our government being a joke and the result of regulatory capture.
They’re “light” trucks under CAFE standards as opposed to real trucks like semis and utility trucks. If they were smaller I think they would be lumped in with all the other normal passenger vehicles.
I feel like the gas and the monthly cost of the loan they took out against their mortgage is probably tax enough.
I genuinely believe most of these super-truck owners already have one foot in the financial grave and are just in denial about it.
The flip side of this is that people who actually want a small, practical truck for utility purposes cannot buy one in the US. Doesn’t exist. Those supertrucks are all you get now, and yeah, the finances don’t make sense for this utility use, either.
And for fucks sake, nobody point me to the Maverick. That is not any kind of small utility truck and you know it. The Maverick is “well, there’s spam egg sausage and spam, that’s not got much spam in it” except for trucks.
Clearly not, because these dickheads are out there driving vehicles that are way over-specced for their use cases, all because they have tiny penises and need to compensate! Some of these things are that tall that you can’t see an average height adult standing in front of the grill from the drivers seat.
Yeah, and they’re not even needed, except as an emotional support vehicle for their impotent owners. Very few are working vehicles - how often are they seen with the bed loaded up?
A coworker was telling me all about how “once you own a truck, you realize all the things you can do with a truck that you couldn’t before”
And like, he’s not wrong but all the things he listed were my non-urgent to-do list that I keep written down and when it has 3-4 items I rent a truck from Uhaul for the day. I spend about $20 while they’re spending thousands on their monthly payment, not to mention gas.
I rarely see anything in the back of these Earth killing things. And where I live, every idiot owns a diesel version. Louder and dirtier.
Hence the need for a higher level of licensure in order to operate one.
OP is not talking about semi trucks
I’m not either.
Japan basically takes those cars off circulation by taxing the ownership to the point that its better to get rid of them as they age. Its great for us who want them in their sub-par age. But we might also want to think about doing the same.
This is COMMUNISM! TRUE FREEDOM is FORCING us to use OVERSIZED Cars that use a LOT of EXPENSIVE Gas! ANYTHING else is WOKE!
In many export markets kei trucks are sold with larger engines than is mandated by the keijidousha regulations of Japan, and come in left hand drive. For example here’s the Suzuki Carry in one export market. These international variants might be more suitable for the US market.
why aren’t they allowed now?
us auto industry has reletively higher crash saftey requirements. part of the reason why everythings so damn big.
the kei trucks are basically rear end death traps if you hit US sized vehicles.
its why the only ones you can legally drive in some states are the ones that pass the 25 year car import law.
some areas explicitly ban it (e.g NYC i believe)
EU: Your truck is unsafe because it is unusually large and has razor sharp edges at head height.
US: Your truck is unsafe because it is too small to withstand a direct hit from one of our super safe giant axe head shaped cars.
“The only way to protect yourself from a giant truck is to have your own giant truck”
Now where have I heard of this logic before? 🤔
No pre installed firearms… Very unsafe…
the good, the bad, and the dodge ram.
Yeah, I swapped the third cupholders for the pistol holster on my dodge.
I’m thinking of buying a ford F1-9001 for my next truck. They have quick-access assault rifle holsters.
Get the Ferd F-teen Thousand
Well the larger trucks are exempt from the safety regulations is the reason it plays out that way. The spirit of the law I think is that they have a special use case and aren’t supposed to be the default vehicle someone would be driving. But it’s a loophole probably written in by the manufacturers themselves and that’s just how it was billed to whatever legislator that signed it.
I understand now allowing them on the freeways, but they’re perfect for cities with their smaller footprint and lower driving speeds. These aren’t allowed in NYC, but Escalades are?
Yeah, I wonder how many NYC traffic deaths involve pedestrians, and how many are just between drivers. This truck would be much safer for pedestrians.
I don’t understand how states can ban an otherwise legal vehicle
They don’t make inflated profits for US companies. That’s what this is about
Cause they’re not really safe to drive. Older US made cars are technically grandfathered in because as time progresses, there will naturally be less and less of them to the point where they won’t be much of an issue on public roads (when was the last time you saw a model t driving down your road other than for a parade or something?). However, a lot of kei trucks were really meant to just be farm vehicles with more utility, so safety wasn’t ever a real hallmark of their design. I considered buying one a while ago, but came to the conclusion that they might actually be less safe than an old S10 which wasn’t really that much bigger.
I’d love to see the state of autos in the US flipped on its head.
None of us want to be killed by the Ford F150 ,000,000.
Are you right about them being unsafe? Timestamped this crash test vid here for y’all. Older video but sticks in my mind.
Newer kei truck in the video, safety standards are different (and higher). The US only allows ones from the 90s, and while a most of them had the engine behind the cab, the cabs are often a bit top-heavy and a forward roll risk.
That’s a newer one and it’s still a death trap? Sigh.
Ah-mazing for private property etc. though!
Safety standards for family vehicles: ok, sure
Safety standards for non-family vehicles: fascist overreach
Also chicken tax
The Mini, Yaris, and many other modern cars pass crash -test standards. I do not consider them big.
Kei trucks have basically no crumple zone or front bumper. They are cab over designs, so if you hit something, you’re basically the first thing that takes the impact.
The newer ones have all the modern safety features (crumple zone, bumper, ABS, etc). But of course we aren’t allowed to import the modern ones.
Even huge semis with cab overs have that issue… Here in Europe where’s they’re essentially all cab overs, sometimes you see some grisly scenes on the highway. Luckily they have other safety features like automatic braking and warnings.
If something goes max 5 kph, shouldn’t it do fine on all the crash tests?
You don’t have to make something bigger. Sometimes just making it slower works too.
Because they used emissions standards in the 80s to remove light trucks from the market. Which is why everything is bigger now, blowback: unintended consequences of shitty legislation.
They used the “Chicken Tax” to remove light trucks on the 80s, not emissions issues.
Ford used to skirt the law by having Transits made in Europe shipped to the US as passenger vehicles. Once in the states they would recycle the seats and replace the rear windows with panels.
They generally don’t meet safety requirements.
