Life is a terminal illness and tomorrow is promised to no one.
Based enabler
And new friend for life, even if only for a day!
I mean they kinda are. It’s called hospice and it’s when they break open the good shit.
Unfortunately, a lot of people arent.
Due largely to religious bullshit (at least in america), its very very difficult to get death with dignity. My grandma has parkinsons, she wants to go on hospice before it takes her brain, but her doctor is Catholic and decided its against his religion to let her die as she wants to.
Shes trying to find a doctor who will let her, but its very very difficult. Its still considered murder in most of the country, and even most Hospice doctors wont do anything besides not resuscitate. We have to be careful to not call an ambulance for her, because if she goes to a hospital, the doctor is allowed to just ignore her DNR if thats against their religion.
Are real actual medical doctors even allowed to do that based on religion?
Not just allowed, actively pushed to do so.
The doctor she goes to did it, just decided that it was against his religion for her to decide to go on hospice care.
Even if he would allow it, in order for her to get on hospice, her doctor would have to go in front of an ethics committee and argue for her to be allowed to go on hospice. If anyone on the ethics committee objects, she isn’t allowed.
California has a right-to-die law (one of very few states that does). You are allowed to die if your doctor can prove that your disease will kill you in 6 months, that you are coherent (at the time of death, you cant sign anything beforehand for it), if you are capable of taking the suicide pills without assistance.
The doctor has to document that you made two separate distinct verbal requests, 48 hours apart. Has to document that your disease will kill you in 6 months, has to document that you are able to take the pills on your own with no assistance (too weak to die? too bad). The case is automatically reviewed (and they will try to take away the doctors license every time).
And anyone involved is allowed to stop you if they object on any grounds.
Killing yourself is a sin in most versions of Christianity, so its effectively illegal in most of the country, and any doctor that is willing to let you has to really really work to not get their license taken and them thrown in jail.
Hospice is not the same thing as assisted suicide though
True.
But Hospice is generally required to get to assisted suicide tho.
Or at least, it was when my dad finally got to die.
The normal doctor wouldn’t do it, the hospital didnt allow it except for in hospice.
And then we had to fight for a week to get the hospice doctor to let him die.
I got severe pushback from a nurse for saying DNR when I was last in the hospital. It seems that healthcare workers often possess no ethics, standards, or intellect in the USA.
A bit more context may be needed, though. I’ve found that medical staff respect DNR wishes (they are legally obligated to do so) but will refuse certain aspects of care with it. E.g. certain types of surgery where your heart may technically stop, or if they have to intubate.
They should be proposing alternative methods of care in that instance, but won’t go through with some things without a DNR (which is ultimately the point of a DNR, they must refuse to save you even if they could). Usually a DNR is for palliative care (you may also hear the term “comfort measures only” (CMO) used).
But I’ve never heard of an instance of a patient showing up to a hospital and then getting turned away for having a DNR on file, at least. They just won’t perform anything too risky where resuscitation may be needed.
Are you not thinking of euthanasia? Hospice is like a care home for people who are dying
The marketing department decided on “assisted suicide” because euthanasia is an icky word. Didn’t you get the memo?
Just like how we have “abortions” instead of “fetus deletus”
They have distinct meanings. Euthanasia = someone else pushes the button. Assisted suicide = you push the button. Assisted suicide is legal in 12 states. Euthanasia is legal in 0.
that is how hospice works. they won’t euthanasia they will just let you die and do theoretical pain management. My mom died of dehydration in hospice because it was “unethical” to just give her a shot of barbituates when half her brain was no longer functioning after a stroke.
That is how hospice works. they won’t euthanasia they will just let you die and do theoretical pain management.
Depends on the doctor. If you get a good one, they will give you a lot of painkillers that will shorten your life significantly.
My mom died of dehydration in hospice because it was “unethical” to just give her a shot of barbituates when half her brain was no longer functioning after a stroke.
Unfortunately, end of life care is very poorly regulated (to protect people).
Check your state law. In some states it is very illegal to ignore a properly filled out DNR, religion or no religion.
Also, hospice is not state assisted suicide. Hospice is comfort care, and it’s not about causing someone to die, it’s about helping someone who is terminal be more comfortable during the time they have left.
Check your state law. In some states it is very illegal to ignore a properly filled out DNR, religion or no religion.
It is 100% legal to refuse medical care because of being Christian. This has been litigated to death.
Its illegal to punish somebody for refusing to provide medical care if they claim that doing so would be against their (christian) religion. This has also been litigated to death.
Also, hospice is not state assisted suicide.
No, but Hospice does include not preventing death if the patient doesnt want to go on a bunch of stuff
Hospice is comfort care, and it’s not about causing someone to die, it’s about helping someone who is terminal be more comfortable during the time they have left.
And usually letting them die when they want to.
Its how my dad finally died, He got hospice and the doctor gave him a massive overdose of Morphine (after multiple days of asking the doctor to let him die).
IDK what kind of hospice you’ve been to but my grandmother was basically pumped full of morphine for nearly an entire year before she passed of “totally not a morphine overdose.”
So you grandma is catholic.
Let’s be clear here.
And yes, killing someone is very problematic. I admit I don’t have the answer.
Let’s not act like this is that simple.
So you grandma is catholic.
No, her doctor is, my grandma is Atheist
Let’s be clear here.
Its pretty fucking clear
And yes, killing someone is very problematic. I admit I don’t have the answer.
I do, let people die when they want to.
Let’s not act like this is that simple.
It really is
I’m sure it’s easier said than done, but can’t she just go to a different doctor? People get second opinions all the time
I’m sure it’s easier said than done, but can’t she just go to a different doctor?
Hypothetically sure. But she is on Medicaid. Getting a new primary care doctor takes a lot of effort.
All of her specialists are in the same network, and all the notes follow her around in her network. The doctor noted that she is “suicidal,” and now nobody in the network will let her get on hospice.
So in order to find a new doctor, she would effectively need to find a new network, get all new specialists, restart all the tests, go back through Medicaid to get a new doctor on her insurance.
Its not actively impossible, but its very difficult, especially for an 85 year old with Parkinson’s. And changing doctors while you have Parkinson’s somewhat managed is a bad idea, its lots of experimenting to find a treatment plan that works, and you have to basically start all that over while you loose a lot of ground.
Its way easier for her to just tell everybody to remember to not call an ambulance for her, she already asked me to help her die when she feels like her mind is too far gone, but since it would be “murder” for me to be in the same room as her while she takes the wrong pills, there isnt a lot I can do.
People get second opinions all the time
Much less common than you think,
And often just enough to let someone with a weak constitution drift off gently into that good night when they’re ready.
It’s one of those unstated aspects of it. It’s not “assisted suicide,” but they’ll hook you up with a PCA pump of morphine alongside scheduled doses of potentially more powerful painkillers that will help you fall asleep and never wake up.
Unless you’re in a “right to die” region and have jumped through all the hoops, they can’t administer a lethal injection of a substance simply intended to kill. But they can administer enough pain medication to kill a horse. They’ll give as much as needed to ensure comfort, which takes priority over organ failure and risk of death, since that is already a bygone conclusion.
Or the nurse/doctor will tell the family exactly how much morphine to “not” give their loved ones because it’ll make them go to sleep forever
My wife died of breast cancer moving to her brain last October. They did NOT break out the good stuff. They supplied the weakest painkillers and measured them every visit so they knew if I was over dosing her or stealing some. And from her reaction I dont think the stuff was strong enough.
a famous one in france a lady was suffering a very rare cancer, the govt refused to give her life-ending drugs, so she got some from the streets, barbituates or whatever and just OD on it.
What a legend. 🫡
“What you gonna do? Put my dead body in jail?”
Ok I have an idea. I’m all for giving people the option of assisted suicide, but it’s just way too medical and boring! I want something with pizazz!
I have a better idea. The US government has been dying to get back into nuclear testing. I say, let’s kill two birds with one atomic bomb! We designate a site out in the Nevada desert somewhere. Then, once a year, anyone who qualifies for assisted suicide gathers there. You have all the regular safeguards existing assisted suicide processes have. Everyone there first says goodbye to their families. Then they walk through the gate, present their ticket, and take a bus to ground zero.
They arrive at dawn. Through the day they have access to every illegal drug one can imagine. Finally at the end of the day, at sundown, a great countdown is held. As the last light of their last day winks out, a second sunrise blooms across the desert. And everyone present goes out in the most epic way imaginable - high out of their minds and instantly vaporized under the light of a thousand suns.
Forget doing this in a hospital or hospice and being given some nasty poison to drink. I want to go out at ground zero of a nuclear explosion! Just put me close enough to the center so I actually get vaporized, not one of those unlucky ones that just gets their skin burned off and has to die painfully over several hours or days.
We’ll call it … burning… man ?
Cute. But my inner engineer and scientist needs to point out that at these temperatures, “burning” doesn’t really apply. At these heat fluxes, you don’t so much combust as simply stop being chemistry and start being physics.
That’s the appeal of it. It’s literally the most painless way possible to go out. Your brain has been turned to plasma before pain signals even have a chance to reach it.
A little on the nose, eh?
Ha, pretty good option. I wouldn’t get a ticket. But, seems reasonable.
I’ll be outside, in a recliner, fire pit going. My friends all around.
I’d sip some of this & that. Eat my favs. And have both music and “MASH” playing until I fade away.
Any adult should be allowed to do whatever the fuck they want with their own body.
100%. Everything bad that can happen because youre out your nut is already illegal, and most of the harm from drugs comes from the gang activity thanks to its illegality.
Next to no teenagers are out there stabbing eachother over loaves of bread
We are all suffering from a terminal condition, known as life.
So yeah drugs for everyone.
People
with terminal illnesses/in their last daysshould be allowed to have any drugs they want.deleted by creator
I think you might be overestimating the capacity to enjoy anything at that point
Exactly why drugs should not be illegal at any time during life, instead of just at the end when some figment of our moral imagination would allow it out of pity.
People in this thread are romanticising end of life as frolicking happily at a party one moment and slipping away in a magical slumber the next.
Most likely you’d be in bed either crying fo pain meds or asleep after having been given pain meds.
I too would, from where i am now love the idea of my consciousness slipping away while tripping on dmt but i recognize that once the time comes i may not desire nor care anymore.
There’s also the option that whatever is killing them may take away their awareness to a degree. My grandfather died of lung cancer when my mother was a little girl but according to my older kith and kin he apparently was questionably lucid up until his final birthday where he was present for the day, he passed away a couple days later after slipping back into a comatose state.
Yes, of course. Most people die from something. I think OP’s point stands though. Enough morphine puts you far away from the pain even if it doesn’t lessen it (I have used it that way for my very rare status migraines before the state disallowed it) and that does provide relief. When I get there, overdose sounds like the best of the set of bad choices available.
My drug of choice would be a massive amount of barbiturates
If I know I’m gonna be dead soon, realistically, who’s gonna stop me?
This reminds me of a former, and actually current coworker. After she gave her notice my previous employer before leaving for my current one, she was freaking out about finishing up a win10 hardening project.
I asked her, “why are you so anxious about it? What are they going to do, fire you?”
What’s stopping you is unavailability of those drugs.
There are definitely some drugs I’ve tried that I would not want to do while staring death in the face. But I agree it should be a personal choice. Basically I think it should be at any point in life.
we’re all in our last days pal
any drugs they want.
How about any drugs they can afford, because that is sort of what we have now (speaking for the US).
How about any drugs they can afford, because that is sort of what we [don’t] have now
FTFY
Sure, yes. I don’t even do drugs anymore, and was never really into opiates when I did, but my experience coming out of anaesthesia with a nurse who was remarkably free handed with opiates in the IV as she didn’t want me to wake up quite yet convinced me that is the way to go. Let me just float out on a soft cloud. It’s an annoying feeling when awake and trying to do anything; but as a death it seems perfect.
I for one would love to try heroine, but I know myself well enough that I am sure I’d get severely addicted and hit rock bottom pretty much immediately. So that’s my deathbed wish.
Drugs should be limited only in regards to they impare people and the activities they do while on them.
Impair
