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You really don’t need to call every dude you dislike “gay”.
That’s a problem for sure if you are using it to insinuate that homosexual relationship are bad.
That’s not what is happening here though, which you know ofc.
They’re probably both bottoming for Putin
That’s a hard sandwich to build, you obviously have Putin as the top piece of bread, but is Trump the meat in this sandwich or is it Musk, whose the bottom bread? And how does Netanyahu fit in to this?
Netanyahu likes to watch
While telling them all what to do.
Musk. I’m pretty sure Trump’s ding a ling can’t get any firmer than an overripe banana nowadays.
Cheers for making me think about trumps limp dick, I didn’t feel like eating this week anyway.
There is no bottom.
There’s always more barrel to scrape. And then there’s the floor. And then there’s the ground beneath the floor. And then there’s miles of bedrock.
That’s what you’re talking about, right?
#TrumpsTheBottom
Is that why he wears diapers?
This is just homophobia, by the way
I’m gay. lol You don’t need to be upset on my behalf, thank you.
How?
Assuming good faith question: The (false) dichotomy of top/bottom implies a power dynamic in which the bottom is subservient to the top. In reality, it’s often a simple preference and bottoms can domineer just as well as tops. Some prefer it that way. And there’s more than top and bottom. Versatile is the obvious third option (no or changing preference for position) as well as side (prefers non-penetrative sex).
There’s this stereotype (may not be the right word) that extends from the above in that tops are more masculine or powerful by virtue of topping, due to the tie with being dominant. Thus bottoms are more feminine and subservient. All of that is false and represents the gay community in a pretty bad, oversimplified, sexist-somewhere-along-the-line way.
The dom/sub axis is not the same as the top/bottom axis (not really an axis).
It’s not just the top/bottom part that’s problematic, it’s the entire post. The punchline is “Trump and Elon are gay for each other, isn’t that funny?” which centers the idea that it would be bad or wrong for them to be gay for each other, perpetuating the conservative stereotype that there’s something wrong with being gay.
Oh FFS.
We (gay people) have been pointing out the hypocrisy of homophobes with this sort of joke for ages and will continue to do it because it’s fucking hilarious. We are, in doing so, celebrating that it’s wonderful to be gay and sad that they don’t see that or see there at times in-the-closet-like behavior.
The last thing thing I need is a bunch of word police telling me what I can and cannot say.
You know who IS making it seem like there’s something wrong with being gay? People like you.
As a “joke” it treats being gay as derogatory. You’re welcome to make shitty homophobic jokes if you want to.
Are you gay?
Are you not ok with being gay if you are? Are you not and experiencing latent homophobia?
Because that’s the only way you can possible conclude that it’s derogatory to call someone gay.
Nobody’s telling you what you can and can’t say. They’re telling you that what you said is in bad taste, and youre telling them to stop saying that.
LOL. I’m pretty sure saying “that is just homophobia, by the way” is exactly trying to tell people what they can and can’t say.
Good call, I missed it. We’ve got layers of shittiness in this meme.
Sure, but the joke here is turning the dumb jokes of the homophobes against them, right? Calling a homophobe “haha u’r gay n a bottom” is kinda using their homophobia against them, no?
Also, I’m gay myself. If someone said “haha, u like taking it up the ass”, I would be like, “sure I do!”. Say this to a homophobe n they would be incredibly offended. So ¯\_(ツ)_/¯
But sure, I get why the morals of this aren’t so straightforward.
You aren’t wrong. It’s rather philosophical at that point. There’s the “don’t say it because it’s shitty angle” (quasi-mine, though mine was more a explanation vs a held belief) vs the “take it back from them” angle. Both have pros/cons and I’m not going to pretend I have the ‘perfect’ answer. The truth is probably that whichever is more effective/least damaging probably varies by context.
This is just absolutely ridiculous. It’s thought police over-engineering for clout.
It’s a dissection of why some people in the LGBT community may be offended. If you’re unwilling to try to see the perspective of others and choose to instead reject empathy, that’s a problem for you and the people around you. This internet stranger will continue to have a good day.
Also, clout? On Lemmy? Oh good, I’ve got the support of all 12 of us…
Are you part of the community?
I am.
It’s a dissection of why some people in the LGBT community may be offended. If you’re unwilling to try to see the perspective of others
I don’t think you see the hypocrisy in your own comments.
Empathy would be you not trying to tell people what to think and say and being willing to see their perspective.
Also, clout? On Lemmy? Oh good, I’ve got the support of all 12 of us…
Hey maybe that’s meaningful to you. It certainly seems to be to many.
I don’t think you see the hypocrisy in your own comments.
I never misunderstood that you’re close minded. I’ll even grant that it can be frustrating to feel like you need a formal course on such things and that it changes entirely too fast and that sometimes it all feels like bullshit (ask me about using the term demisexual wrong* on the internet one time). But the world is made better when we work to understand others, which you’ve demonstrated that as being a non-priority for you.
It certainly seems to be to many.
Then why are you here?
you really can’t see how using sexuality to mock someone you hate is homophobic?
Calling a homophobe gay isn’t homophobia though, is it
Yeah, it is. It reinforces the idea that there is something wrong with a gay homophobe being gay, rather than the problem being that they are a homophobe.
it’s perpetuating the view that calling someone “gay” is somehow an insult.
you really can’t see how using sexuality to mock someone you hate is homophobic?
It’s not using sexuality to mock someone. It’s using hypocrisy to mock someone.
You know what’s the same thing? When gay men call each other fags or lesbians dykes. It’s taking what was intended as derogatory and flipping it around to celebrate it. It’s the ideal response to bullying assholes of any kind.
It’s not using sexuality to mock someone. It’s using hypocrisy to mock someone.
I guess it would make it okay to call a black right-winger an N-word and talk about how he can’t swim and only eats chicken and watermelon, then?
When gay men call each other fags or lesbians dykes
and I’m sure you know that not everyone is comfortable doing that because of their lived experiences. it’s awesome that homophobic jokes don’t affect you, but not everyone can distance themselves from them.
I guess it would make it okay to call a black right-winger an N-word and talk about how he can’t swim and only eats chicken and watermelon, then?
If you are black, yes, it would be ok. And many black people do. It’s the exact same defense mechanism.
and I’m sure you know that not everyone is comfortable doing that because of their lived experiences.
Then let them not be comfortable with it and let me and my people alone. Do not try to police my language just because perceive someone somewhere to have experienced some mild discomfort… and why? WHY DO I SAY THIS?
Because honey, they need to arm themselves against that discomfort. You need to have a shield and that shield is OWNING the words. If you let people who use derogatory words own them you have lost power.
Are you serious?
… you could just explain your logic you know.
It isn’t the general consensus.
calls out a post for being homophobia topped with an extra serving of homophobia
less upvotes than someone who thinks “haha gay” isn’t homophobic
😒
Thanks for trying.
Oh please do fuck off with that shit, Karen.
I remember when calling someone a Karen was a word with a meaning, specifically calling out bigoted white women - those who would punch down. This is the opposite; someone calling out bigotry.
It’s an attack on their perception of the community, not the community.
It would seem that’s too complicated a concept for some folks.
This is just homophobia, by the way
Tell us you are not a gay man without telling us you are not a gay man.
Edit: Probably 85% of my social circle is some delicious flavor of queer. Kinda comes with being queer I guess. We make these jokes in part to normalize this sexuality and to make fun of hypocrites and bullies. It’s the same thing as when the kid in school says “that’s so gay” and you reply “oh really? You wanna get together later?”. This has come up a few times - the sensitivity of some groups to these kinds of jokes - and the conclusion is basically that people who object to them are generally either not queer or insecure about being queer and want to exert control over the conversation either to get cred with the community or to assuage their fears.
and the conclusion is basically that people who object to them are generally either not queer or insecure about being queer and want to exert control over the conversation either to get cred with the community or to assuage their fears.
You have some pretty intense coping mechanisms. What’s wild is I’d wager it’s much more effort to make up these stories than to actually understand the point being made, yet here you are.
You have some pretty intense coping mechanisms.
Talk to any queer person who lived through the 80s and 90s and you will find that desire to own the language of being queer was kind of a priority. I’ve been beaten, escaped rape, disowned by my family. So yeah figuring out how to cope was something we did.
You on the other hand?
What’s wild is I’d wager it’s much more effort to make up these stories than to actually understand the point being made, yet here you are.
Go FYS. No seriously. I paid for this with blood. You can fuck ALL they way off. You make NO effort yourself to understand why I say the things I say and why it’s so incredibly offensive to me to have someone try to police my language.
At some point, some people lose the ability (or never had it) to understand or care about the perspectives of others. Instead you get this knee jerk “anyone who is offended by what I say is the thought police and didn’t live my life, blah blah blah”. They never stop to realize that they didn’t live the other person’s life and they might have different, equally valid reasons for finding something offensive.
But no, it’s you being persecuted as you’re more entitled to say whatever you’d like and anyone who is offended should just shut the fuck up and deal with it. This sounds familiar… It’s what your lot’s MAGAs blather on about! Great job, you’re no smarter than a red hat. LOL
I’ll just leave this here:
They never stop to realize that they didn’t live the other person’s life and they might have different, equally valid reasons for finding something offensive.
Holy shit this is peak white cishet liberal lol
While you just have to assume I’m any or all of those, your commentary means I don’t have to assume you’re an idiot.
Just because you are gay does not mean you are not homophobic.
They likely meant that it’s a joke about power dynamics implying sexual preference. That is homophobic, but funny, but also homophobic.
In short, just cause you like it up your arse doesn’t mean you are a spineless idiot with no power. Instead Let people enjoy things and try to stop the spread of these stereotypes even in jokes. You never know who hears them and what social climate you might propagate into the heads of others and youth. If you are aware of these caveats you are allowed to make the most offensive jokes.
Um… WHAT?
Hey we got our first illegal immigrant president, if that ain’t woke I don’t know what is.
The thing I love the most about these memes is they’re seriously effective.
Are they though? I feel like they just make those that found Trump and Elon to be really weird and rotten, have a laugh. I don’t know anyone conservative, that has commented on these kinds of memes, to me or others I know.
Or did you mean effective in pulling some political stance BBJ reversal moves?
It’s effective in driving a rift between Musk and Trump, as many news outlets are reporting that they’ve been contacted by the Trump PR Team to clarify that Trump is in charge after the “President Musk” taunting began. Trump’s superiority complex and vanity is absolute, so being upstaged by a positionless goon will make him very unhappy.
Although, I concede that we don’t know what actual longterm effect if any this will truly have.
they’ve been contacted by the Trump PR Team to clarify that Trump is in charge after the “President Musk” taunting began.
Ugh, the childish insecurities are not befitting of someone in charge of anything, let alone a country. Dude is seriously a loser. Despite all that money and power, at the core, he’s just an insecure loser.
Oh I see. That’s a solid take on the situation IMO. Haha yeah. Time will tell what comes of this shit show being put on by goons, and loons, set on the verge of collapse, USA. Let dumpster fires light their way.
With those two divas fighting, it’s gonna be several dumpsters full of illegal fireworks. The inept president of the us vs the comparably inept richest man in the world riling up the same cult against each other. Do you think they realized they were in a highlander situation before they got in bed together?
Think about how effecrive they could have been before the election.
Instead the Dems played patty cakes with the republican party.
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The hell? You’re in the wrong comment section lmao.
Maybe. I dont think the memes are really that effective promoting any kind of material change.
We’re already past the election, and Trump is riding high as a “very popular” politician.
Anything the Left says is basically ignored.
Is it really not obvious who the bottom is?
Yeah, Trump’s soft, shitty brain is no match for Elon’s younger, shitty brain.
I mean, I bet trump is pretty lubed on a consistent basis, with his uncontrollable, oh so very wet sounds he makes. I’ll put money on him being the bottom.
Like Ernst Röhm and Adolf Hitler. We know how that ended for both losers.
I think the more accurate parallel is Henry Ford and Woodrow Wilson, unfortunately.
I think they both just watch each other jack off like two cucks.
That sounds kinda homophobic, ngl
How?
Well, it’s definitely kinkshaming and I’m told that’s a big no-no
Well, it’s definitely kinkshaming
At no point did anyone say that two people watching each other jack off was BAD.
Yeah, and it’s an important part of the insult that it works on the bad people only because they are bad people to begin with. It’s fun like that.
And it even does that in a multifaceted way! It calls bigots gay and it calls magalomaniacs subservient and weak.
Right
Careful kids, the thought police are out in force today. Don’t say anything that might be deemed offensive by <some group I’m not part of> at some point in history!
I think it’s reasonable to ask why bottoming is presented as inherently degrading/submissive. (Same with giving oral - the insult “cocksucker.”) The vast majority of gay men I know are mostly verse anyway, the distinction of top and bottom to some extent seems like a carryover from heterosexual culture.
Like yes, it’s just a meme, but it’s revealing of larger problematic attitudes. I’ve made the same kinds of jokes too, but there would be nothing worse about Trump were he to receive anal sex from Musk (as unpleasant as that image is.)
Just a take look at history and how it all worked back in the Antiquity/Rome, which half the Internet likes to celebrate as gay friendly. It’s fairly ingrained in European culture/history.
The “Nazi femboy” phenomenon seems to harken back to that. Patriarchal structures aren’t undermined as long as the receptive partner is submissive/feminine.
I think it’s reasonable to ask why bottoming is presented as inherently degrading/submissive.
Yes, it is. But it’s up to the bottom to decide how they wish to be represented. Not for some self-appointed language police on the internet to decide for them. Among people I know there is a wide variety of attitudes about this but it’s absolutely universal that top/bottom/switch (or verse as you say) is indeed a power dynamic (that’s kinda the point for many) but only in that moment. It’s not a reflection of inferiority or weakness and it’s funny to me that people would think that. Makes me think they haven’t ever been involved in any type of BDSM activities.
Like yes, it’s just a meme, but it’s revealing of larger problematic attitudes.
Who gets to decide what attitudes are “problematic”?
I spent almost a decade of my life in TPE. Please do not lecture me about BDSM.
The acts themselves are not inherently submissive, and most kinksters I knew were uncomfortable with that suggestion.
I am deciding to express my discomfort with the terminology - that’s a decision I can make. I am a bottom, and submissive even! But I could also present the activity as dominant - in that I am lying back and expecting someone to provide me with pleasure. I have even “topped” individuals in a submissive way.
The meme is clearly presenting receptive anal sex as inherently degrading, which is a common narrative.
Who’s lecturing you? How are you being lectured?
At least we seem to agree. I’d have taken that as the opposite of a lecture. But hey, whatevs.
Damn. You’re annoying
Were you unaware of the “Block User” function?
Don’t say anything that might be deemed offensive
Haha. Sex between men is a power dynamic. Teehee. Real intimacy is unattainable between male lovers. Giggle. Pleasure from anal sex is shameful.
Boo hoo.
Don’t be sad. Think of it as a performance. We don’t get to clap at the end because in some communities that’s considered offensive, but I have heard there will be cake.
Dude, people just pointed out that what was said could be offensive, and you went full snowflake. Chill out.
No. I went full “hey, here’s why I don’t think that’s offensive” and THEY went full snowflake.
It’s not offensive to you, but it is offensive to others. This is a fact that, throughout this conversation, you have absolutely failed to see or accept. That’s all anyone here has wanted you to see.
I’m happy that you aren’t offended and you’re absolutely free to speak as you will. But your words have meaning that will differ from one person to another. That’s all.
It’s not offensive to you, but it is offensive to others.
I acknowledge that. I may not have spelled it out but I also didn’t say it wasn’t. You just assumed. You also assume that it’s offensive to some huge swath of people. How many? Who are they? Do you know them personally? Is there a percentage of the population at which we must stop saying certain things? Do people not members of the affected group get to decide this? I’ve literally encountered situations where people have told me not to use hand gestures common in my culture because it’s offensive somewhere to someone even though those people were not there and I was not likely EVER to encounter them in my entire life. I’ve had people make a huge fuss over correcting people who misgendered me even though I never fucking asked for it or wanted it.
That’s the extreme we are at now.
What this boils down to is people like yourself needing to control what other people are allowed to say and yes, even think. And I absolutely don’t mind putting effort in to respecting people’s wishes with regard to language when it’s asked for or it’s so obviously required. But that’s not the case here - the language police are always self-appointed. Look at this whole discussion. Did I miss all the gay men saying how offended they were by this meme? Did all my friends just lie to me when they’ve made jokes like this? Again, what percentage are we going by here?
You say oh I’m “absolutely free to speak” as I will but that’s not really what you mean. You mean to say “oh you are free to be an asshole by our sole definition and decree and never mind what you think”.
What gives you that power?
tl;dr
Go yell at another cloud, angry old man (or woman, idc)
I’m over you.
Trump is willing to Bottom because Elon really really wants to Top.
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