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Doctors used to believe that babies couldn’t feel/understand pain.
More like doctors reject inconvenient truth in favor of useful lie
Humans in general, not just doctors. Not all humans but it’s not a rare trait. Or maybe all humans and I’m doing it myself by leaving that opening, which might be accepted because others also want to believe they don’t.
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And that apples are dangerous.
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“A lethal dose of cyanide is around 50–300 milligrams (mg). A 2018 analysis of previous research states that a person would have to eat around 83–500 seeds to develop acute cyanide poisoning.” Medical News Today, citing 2018 Oxford analysis
A redditor also did the math on how many apples that would be: "Apple seeds can release as much as 0.6 mg of Cyanide per gram of seed.
The average apple seed has a mass of 0.756 grams
The average apple contains 8 seeds
Therefore there are approximately 5.25 grams of apple seeds per apple, yielding a theoretical maximum release of 3.25 mg of cyanide from one apple
The lethal dose of Cyanide is based on body mass and is listed as 1.5 mg/kg.
A human can ingest about 41% of the lethal dose before seeing any side effects.
41% of 1.5 mg/kg = 0.615 mg/kg
The average adult male weighs 81.6466 kg (180 lbs)
Therefore the lethal dose in the average male is 50.213 mg.
50.213/3.15 = ~16 Apples
Therefore the average male can consume ~16 apples without feeling any side effects."
Unless you are a doctor that does not give pain relief for IUD.
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I’m not sure what you mean by this; the cervix is known to have many nerve endings and is accepted medical knowledge.
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Um, yes they do. They tell us to take ibuprofen before the procedure.
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I had epidurals for all my childbirths. I’ve had three IUD insertions, only one with ibuprofen. IUD insertion doesn’t hurt much at all either way. Just a moment of pinch & cramp then it’s fine. That has been my subjective experience.
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Sure I understand that, especially for your personal experiences. I also recognize this has historically been a huge issue. I work closely with doctors and nurse practitioners in women’s health (L&D, urogynecology, etc.) and they all take it very seriously (they are of mixed genders). I think it depends on the area and expertise of the doctor, but this is an outdated mindset that is (in my experience) quickly becoming obsolete as more voices are raised and research is published. I’m just against the sweeping generalization of “doctors believe” or “doctors think” and am quick to call it out for clarification. It has been used to support people avoiding healthcare practioners or trusting modern medical science. Saying “my doctor was shitty because they don’t listen to my concerns” is super valid and should be acknowledged, but “doctors don’t listen to women” is not a fair representation.
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That is a valid stance to take based on your history. I’ve acknowledged your personal experiences may differ. I was not trying to “cancel out” your viewpoint, the same way I don’t think it would be fair to discount mine.
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I’m a bearded white dude who has been doubted by dumbass doctors. It’s why I vastly prefer women doctors, ironically. I can’t fathom what others go through if that’s my experience as a khaki wall.
Male doctors.
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Interesting, too bad the article doesn’t go deep enough and doesn’t explore the psychological effects.
I mean, they certainly don’t understand it yet. They absolutely feel it and react instinctively to it, though. It might even form a traumatic memory of a sort that will affect them later in life.
The real question is, does it matter? If pain doesn’t change future behavior or outcomes, especially with having no memory of that pain, what does it matter?
Same for boiling someone alive… How you die doesn’t really matter, because if you aren’t going to survive, the experience didn’t impact anything.
It’s actually very environmentally friendly to eat humans so the momentary pain is offset by the collective good.
It’s only environmentally friendly to eat humans with a net worth over a certain amount.
Oh but you always suggest that Johnny.
It’s actually not, the average industrialized nation human requires several tons of carbon in upkeep per year, so if you’re harvesting them at 20 years you’re adding dozens if not hundreds of tons of carbon into the environment.
You’re not taking into account the fifty years of no carbon footprint if you eat them at twenty.
You know, I’ve read that stabbing them through their head doesn’t really kill them because they have distributed ganglia instead of one centralized brain.
Sounds like something big boiling pot would say.
Nah, they usually say stuff like “That kettle is black!”
You need to define what the word alive means first.
If you cut a roach’s head, it stays sort of alive in that the body responds when trying to touch it or expose it to harm but it won’t do anything if left alone. just standing still until eventual death.
A decapitated roach might still be able to “feel” pain but in my personal opinion - I am no expert in the matter - it doesn’t feel stress, trauma or have bad memory of the incident. Just pain and an appropriate reflex to it.
In this context “alive” means “still able to feel and process pain.”
How does the decapitated roach feel the pain? The processing unit has been disconnected from the source of pain.
No it hasn’t been. Cockroaches, lobsters, and other arthropods have a decentralized nervous system. They have ganglia throughout their entire body instead of one centralized brain. These ganglia can react to stimuli independent of the other ones.
https://www.scientificamerican.com/article/fact-or-fiction-cockroach-can-live-without-head/
So does this mean stab the lobsters or don’t stab the lobsters? I was raised on the NE shore and have cooked hundreds of lobsters, I used to do the trick of putting them face down and stroking the spine, that would work ok but they wake up when you move them to the pot. I started stabbing the lobsters a few summers ago after a chef I worked with told me I should be, but I wasn’t convinced it was a lot more humane and it’s not fun if there’s kids around lol.
I can’t tell you for sure which is quicker or more painless. I’m not a marine biologist and even if I were I don’t think I’d have the answer on another creature’s consciousness. Personally I think it’s really just cope and it’s splitting hairs at that point. You just need to face the fact that you’re killing and eating a living creature.
I’ve got no qualms with killing and eating something, I make an effort to dispatch those animals as quickly and humanely as possible, thus the question.
Yes, “decentralised”, “can react to”, but what about perceiving? That’s what modern mortality cares about. Most plants react to stabbing but since there isn’t any processing unit of such signals, we humans don’t take moral punishment from doing so. We don’t emphasize non-sensual creatures.
Honestly they may not be able to perceive in any way we would recognize. Arthropods are about as distant as you can get from humans while still being in the animal kingdom, were in Maine and they’re in American Samoa. So while they most certainly perceive the question of sentience in the more traditional sense is up for debate, though there is at least one species of spider that has a proto-brain so it isn’t universal.
I had a girlfriend like that once. It didn’t work out. She did, fortunately, taste great with garlic butter so the relationship wasn’t a total loss.
When I was a kid, I watched a TV show with one of Australia’s early ‘celebrity’ chefs, Bernard King. He had a live lobster in front of him, which he then proceeded to cut the tail from. The lobster made audible ‘squeeee!’ noises, and tried to move away. He just laughed and said it couldn’t feel anything.
Anyway, he was a cunt.
You wouldn’t do this to your cat. Or your dog. Or any other pet. Why should they have to go through it?
I would eat both of it were legal. Dog meat has been described to me multiple times and it sounds devine. Cats used to be called rooftop chickens. If you’re unwilling to eat X meat because of sympathy, I think you’re a bad omnivor. Also my family recently survived a famine so I feel it’s disrespectful to my ancestors
Not the question.
We should just start eating humans. They are pointless and invasive and they eat meat as a choice.
Risk of Prion‘s disease is too high.
Oh no
I don’t know man, due to sympathy neither my dogs, cats or goats would eat each other or humans. And 2 of them are carnivores.
Yeah right your cat doesn’t eat you because of sympathy 😂
Did you ever have a feline friend? Like a real friendship?
This friendship you are talking about only exists because it didn’t kill you from the start because you are big and scary
https://youtube.com/watch?v=ewxCyRaECC0
Because I can’t find the actual comic.
Cats are well known for eating their former owners after they die.
Yeah after at least a week or right before they starve to death themselves, like dogs.
So you have a cat?
I don’t have a cat but I do love cats. I have a healthy respect and understanding with them. If our positions were reversed I’d be nibbling on my human’s ear when they came to check on them!
Disrespecting your ancestors has been a miracle for my cholesterol levels
Dog and Cat meat are entirely legal to eat, it’s just there’s no legal way to acquire them
I’m sure it’s disrespectful to our ancestors if we could work for a livable wage as well. Some of us care a little bit more about future generations.
I judge people who don’t sever the notochord first. It’s like the most basic respect you can offer.
I think the most basic respect you can offer an animal is to just not kill it.
That’s fair. I accept that I am not the second coming, but I live in this world as best I can while still enjoying the comforts it offers
i don’t think any living animal actively offers themself for your culinary pleasure.
Well there’s that one guy that wanted someone to eat his penis or whatever. I believe he even paid.
Is this the guy who wanted to have gay sex before the cannibalism while the other guy was mostly just there for the cannibalism?
Then that guy got convicted for murder on a technicallity because the footage (they also recorded everything) showed that the guy whose penis was eaten had yet to die from bloodloss like he wanted?
I heard that one on a Redhanded podcast episode.
Yeah I believe that’s the same one
The internet is what enabled this to happen.
Is that why you feel the way you do?
Perhaps not, but he openly admits he does his best. That’s enough
Their best is to accept the death of a sentient species to satisfy a simple carnal pleasure? Pathetic.
Not everyone carries your value system. Get over it.
You respect where your food comes from. Enjoy your well-deserved comforts, haters are gonna hate
Speaking of food, love the UN! Spinach is one of my favorite things.
Thank you, I’m also a huge fan of spinach! I also love lazy wordplay and alliteration - I’ve been thinking of making an alt account called lethargiclettuce just cuz haha. Your UN also made me smile for the same reason haha
That should apply to all living things. Kind of makes it hard to survive if we do that, though.
There’s a goldilocks zone where our own individual longevity can be met while simultaneously causing the least harm to all life, within practicality. That zone being within the territory of the blue zones to one degree or another. Or to be straight to the point, it is completely unnecessary for the vast majority of people to ever need to depend on animal products for food.
Not really. Just like everything else it’s just a little bit of a learning curve. Then it becomes normal and easy.
Not eating anything at all is “just a bit of a learning curve”?! What, are you one of those breatharians?
Not eating meat obviously.
Right, that’s not what I was talking about.
Then I don’t understand your main comment. You mean stuff like bugs that hit your windshield?
Babies don’t have a notochord, though. It disappears earlier in fetal development in vertebrates.
So… We can eat babies then, right? Need an answer sooner than later.
It doesn’t actually kill them, and it’s so small that you’re likely to miss it anyway.
Killing them isn’t the point, it’s to prevent suffering.
They don’t have a nervous system like vertebrates do. They can still feel pain if you slice them through the head because they have a network of ganglia throughout their body, not one centralized brain.
This is weirdly distrubing and morbid to read. Not that it matters.
That noise that sounds like screaming is just the air leaving his lungs
Oh thank god. I thought they would die.
I learned that when I was a kid (more than 25 years ago), and I was like why is this aloud and not forbidden…
Wait, do the lobsters scream? :(
As I understand it, it’s the steam escaping from the shells. The screaming (whistling) sound is present at the end of the cooking process (long after they’re dead), not the beginning.
Humans couldn’t possibly experience pain in a way that matters. They only have one nerve cluster! How much processing power could they have?
The irony hits harder than the boiling water 😭
