This claims to be his story. I haven’t verified it, but I have no reason not to believe it. Basically, UHC tortured his mother for years through denial of care, then they did the same to him.I would note that he is 26 years old: He likely just aged out of his parents’ health insurance policy, and I would guess that he can’t get decent coverage on his own due to his pre-existing condition.Edit: This has since been described as impersonation. While there is certainly a truth to it, it is not the truth.
Because of the ACA (Obamacare) requirements, he can’t be refused or charged more for coverage because of a pre-existing condition.
Whether that insurance denies claims for treatment, however, is still very much in play. I’ve heard you should ask the names and certification of the person or people responsible for the denial of your claim, in writing. Because a lot of the time it’s an algorithm or an unqualified peon, and the company can get in trouble for that.
the company can get in trouble for that.
Tricky to press charges when you’re dying
Oh sweet summer child.
I imagine you mean they won’t, and you may be right. But too many people don’t even start trying to fight denials, which is why insurance companies do it. Often it doesn’t take a huge pushback to get them to change, especially if it would expose their corrupt practices. Of course, sometimes they are obdurate, and United Healthcare is one of the worst.
As for the ACA, it’s still true, at least until Trump takes office.
You’ll tooootally get that information.
I’m deeply curious about the source
I, too, am curious. But, I read this part of a short story in The Things They Carried, many, many, years ago, and it stuck with me:
You can tell a true war story by the questions you ask. Somebody tells a story, let’s say, and afterward you ask, “Is it true?” and if the answer matters, you’ve got your answer.
For example, we’ve all heard this one. Four guys go down a trail. A grenade sails out. One guy jumps on it and takes the blast and saves his three buddies.
Is it true?
The answer matters.
You’d feel cheated if it never happened. Without the grounding reality, it’s just a trite bit of puffery, pure Hollywood, untrue in the way all such stories are untrue. Yet even if it did happen - and maybe it did, anything’s possible even then you know it can’t be true, because a true war story does not depend upon that kind of truth. Absolute occurrence is irrelevant. A thing may happen and be a total lie; another thing may not happen and be truer than the truth. For example: Four guys go down a trail. A grenade sails out. One guy jumps on it and takes the blast, but it’s a killer grenade and everybody dies anyway. Before they die, though, one of the dead guys says, “The fuck you do that for?” and the jumper says, “Story of my life, man,” and the other guy starts to smile but he’s dead.
That’s a true story that never happened.
I don’t know that this article was written by Luigi Mangione, or if Luigi Mangione killed the CEO. But, I do know that this story is true, even if it never happened.
i think there are two different meanings of truth here, and it sounds like one of them might be referring to aletheia. from the wikipedia page:
Heidegger gave an etymological analysis of aletheia and drew out an understanding of the term as “unconcealedness”.[6] Thus, aletheia is distinct from conceptions of truth understood as statements which accurately describe a state of affairs (correspondence), or statements which fit properly into a system taken as a whole (coherence). Instead, Heidegger focused on the elucidation of how an ontological “world” is disclosed, or opened up, in which things are made intelligible for human beings in the first place, as part of a holistically structured background of meaning.
edit: just want to say that i agree with the message, and i think it’s true that things don’t have to actually happened in order to be true in some sense. i think the term aletheia can be helpful for making the distinction and wanted to share it for that reason
New concept, still confused. Sounds like a combination of ‘what’ and ‘why’. The ‘why’ always matters but doesn’t precede the ‘what’.
Like a death by accident, doesn’t matter if someone was drunk or sober. Dead, is ultimately dead.
The truth lies in the heart of the beholder. If the story speaks to you in some particular way, if it resonates deeply enough, then it’s speaking to something you know to be true about the world as you know it. Something which remains true regardless of whether the story is factual or not.
It speaks to something you believe to be true. There is a difference and it’s rather important.
Populist political campaigns speak to such “truths” all the time but the belief of a lot of people that [insert outgroup here] are responsible for all the bad things and that we can all live a great life if we just let [insert strongman here] have absolute power so he can punish them is still just a belief, not truth. Declaring it to be the truth just devalues the concept of truth.
We’re all biased. We should try not to confuse our biases with reality.
Not just populists: many groups have less concern for the truth across the whole political spectrum. Example: feminists and their claim that women make an ever decreasing amount of money relative to men. This claim is based on a single study that compared sweeping aggregate data, and then called the whole thing an actionable issue.
The problem is that when you get into the weeds of the claim, and you should always do so, you find that there are so many confounding variables that went unaccounted for that the study cannot reasonably conclude anything. Meanwhile women have been graduating at higher rates since the 90s, younger generations of women make more money on average than men, and women have more job security than men. Women also get substantial benefits throughout their education and are considered a minority class for the purposes of hiring in many jurisdictions.
Be wary of people driven by agendas, even (or perhaps especially) the agendas you think are good.
I really hope this is genuine, because whoever wrote this did an amazing job of conveying their feelings and experiences in a very short piece of literature.
Doubt. Doesn’t include any of the statements authorities have quoted. They also mentioned the handwritten manifesto was 262 words.
Even if this isn’t the manifesto, his family had money, this reads like it was written by a high schooler, and it was posted yesterday.
real one was just posted https://www.kenklippenstein.com/p/luigis-manifesto
This does seem very amateurish (Gladiator, Greenday, “smile through the pain”). These are emo tropes. I’d be disappointed to know it’s him.
You’d be disappointed if he isn’t also a genius writer?
Not necessarily but basing an idealogy in fantasy (as he talks about the emperor being god in gladiator) neglects reality. Anger and whatever sense of righteousness you subscribe to should be based firmly in reality, otherwise you’ll find you are acting on nothing but hypotheticals.
I don’t see the issue in quoting works of fiction if you think they express something you’re trying to say. People quote Shakespeare all the time to make a point but nobody cares because that’s old and accepted. No I’m not saying Gladiator is on a level with Shakespeare but there’s a weird imbalance in what you’re allowed to quote in your argument and what not. If the imagery spoke to him, why not?
Point taken. I will admit I have been more critical given I don’t believe this is real.
I don’t see the issue in quoting works of fiction
Otherwise the whole of marxism would be off limits
Did… Did you just gatekeep anger?
I liked that the writer stuck with clear and simple english instead of flowering up their prose, but I just feel that using borrowed quips and popart philosophy isn’t an honest way to write. It feels more in line with a teen or a young adult trying to find their voice in the words of others (and we’ve all been there)
I still feel being “disappointed” is harsh. He’s 26 and just wanted his thoughts out. He may have been trying, maybe even subconsciously, to emulate some literary devices more or less successfully in an effort to better convey his feelings but I really don’t think the point was to write great literature.
To theirs credit, the part about watching their mother suffer was very relatable and felt extremely honest. I guess I was hoping that they would open with something like that instead of talking about their philosophy first. You’re right though, the writer is likely young and I shouldn’t expect so much.
I doubt anything NYPD has published so far. it’s all sus.
It just shows anyone can do the right thing
He did everything right and believed in the system.
And then he himself, or someone close to him, got a diagnosis that ensured life-long medical debt and poverty.He seems to have had a spinal surgery and had pins put in his spine. Books he’s looked at seems to indicate chronic pain and fights with insurance companies.
It was exactly what every single person thought who wasn’t paid to think otherwise.
The privatized healthcare system happened.
The simplest answer is he was pissed at UHC for denying medical claims for him or the ones he loved, and the CEO had dialed up the denials so an obvious target.
iirc on one of his social medias the banner was a back X-ray with medical nails or screws in it. I assume he (or someone he knows) was having back issues and got denied.
His former college roommate said he always struggled with back problems which is one reason he tried to work out so much
Someone said he was in a surfing accident and needed pins/plates put in his back. His profile (https://i.imgur.com/2g1ZGBa.png) shows an X-ray of a back that’s had surgery done on it.
He’s 26 and just come off his parents’ healthcare. [Except his family is wealthy, so I’m not sure if this one is relevant or not.]
You can be wealthy and not be “pay your own medical bills” wealthy.
Doesn’t his family own nursing homes and other businesses? Shouldn’t that be wealthy enough for healthcare? You would think there are some connections to the medical sector there as well.
Nursing homes are typically run poorly because they’re in a position that has a hard max on profit. Medicare pays what it pays and that is all. Unlike a hospital which can just make things up and charge whatever, alongside pricy elective surgeries, nursing homes have settled into their x Medicare $$ for each patient.
So while there is profit it won’t be anywhere near the profit of a hospital.
Couldn’t a private nursing home charge whatever they want for room fees, recreation fees, meal fees etc? There are some very shitty nursing homes and some very fancy ones out there, and id bet the profit margins on the fancy ones are much higher.
A long term care bed at a nursing home costs anywhere between $5500 to $20000 monthly. There are many rich, retired people who would have their finances depleted in a few years with a cost that high.
The average middle class individual would never be able to afford that so the fall back is usually medicaid.
There are private pay. And there are Medicare pay. Depends. Any will charge for anything: private room, tv, etc. Meals are mandated by regulation.
So yes, if they own private pay they could be wealthy. Which shows how shitty health insurance has become, if they can afford Luigi’s posh schooling and not afford their healthcare.
US doctors can’t always afford healthcare
Apparently his mother was also being screwed around by UHC.
Sometimes you can have wealthy parents and still barely make ends meet
This, also, just because he may have had good coverage to do the surgery, stuff like that can have lifelong consequences that can need routine, expensive, medical care, for years, if not the rest of your life. Even if they are getting care, their insurance, even “good” insurance, could have denied much better therapy, for the cheaper route, which will have a major negative impact.
It is too early to be making up our minds about this arrest, this guy, etc. However, just because your parents have money, doesn’t mean you can escape the evils of the private healthcare system.
Either Luigi ain’t the guy, or bro or someone he knows got cancer or some shit and had United health insurance deny life-saving drugs/operations.
I saw a post earlier supposedly showing Luigi’s
neck/upper backlower back X-rays after some sort of surgery to install support implants of some sort.https://lemmy.world/post/22966582
Disclaimer: Just like most everyone else online, I can’t confirm or deny a damn thing.
Edit: I stand corrected, that was his lower back.
that’s the lower spine and tailbone
This is what he left as a last message apparently…
The Allopathic Complex and Its Consequences luigi mangione’s last words LM Dec 09, 2024
The second amendment means I am my own chief executive and commander in chief of my own military. I authorize my own act of self-defense in response to a hostile entity making war on me and my family. Nelson Mandela says no form of viooence can be excused. Camus says it’s all the same, whether you live or die or have a cup of coffee. MLK says violence never brings permanent peace. Gandhi says that non-violence is the mightiest power available to mankind. That’s who they tell you are heroes. That’s who our revolutionaries are. Yet is that not capitalistic? Non-violence keeps the system working at full speed ahead. What did it get us. Look in the mirror. They want us to be non-violent, so that they can grow fat off the blood they take from us. The only way out is through. Not all of us will make it. Each of us is our own chief executive. You have to decide what you will tolerate. In Gladiator 1 Maximus cuts into the military tattoo that identifies him as part of the roman legion. His friend asks “Is that the sign of your god?” As Maximus carves deeper into his own flesh, as his own blood drips down his skin, Maximus smiles and nods yes. The tattoo represents the emperor, who is god. The god emperor has made himself part of Maximus’s own flesh. The only way to destroy the emperor is to destroy himself. Maximus smiles through the pain because he knows it is worth it. These might be my last words. I don’t know when they will come for me. I will resist them at any cost. That’s why I smile through the pain.
They diagnosed my mother with severe neuropathy when she was forty-one years old. She said it started ten years before that with burning sensations in her feet and occasional sharp stabbing pains. At first the pain would last a few moments, then fade to tingling, then numbness, then fade to nothing a few days later. The first time the pain came she ignored it. Then it came a couple times a year and she ignored it. Then every couple months. Then a couple times a month. Then a couple times a week. At that point by the time the tingling faded to numbness, the pain would start, and the discomfort was constant. At that point even going from the couch to the kitchen to make her own lunch became a major endeavor She started with ibuprofen, until the stomach aches and acid reflux made her switch to acetaminophen. Then the headaches and barely sleeping made her switch back to ibuprofen. The first doctor said it was psychosomatic. Nothing was wrong. She needed to relax, destress, sleep more. The second doctor said it was a compressed nerve in her spine. She needed back surgery. It would cost $180,000. Recovery would be six months minimum before walking again. Twelve months for full potential recovery, and she would never lift more than ten pounds of weight again. The third doctor performed a Nerve Conduction Study, Electromyography, MRI, and blood tests. Each test cost $800 to $1200. She hit the $6000 deductible of her UnitedHealthcare plan in October. Then the doctor went on vacation, and my mother wasn’t able to resume tests until January when her deductible reset. The tests showed severe neuropathy. The $180,000 surgery would have had no effect. They prescribed opioids for the pain. At first the pain relief was worth the price of constant mental fog and constipation. She didn’t tell me about that until later. All I remember is we took a trip for the first time in years, when she drove me to Monterey to go to the aquarium. I saw an otter in real life, swimming on its back. We left at 7am and listened to Green Day on the four-hour car ride. Over time, the opioids stopped working. They made her MORE sensitive to pain, and she felt withdrawal symptoms after just two or three hours. Then gabapentin. By now the pain was so bad she couldn’t exercise, which compounded the weight gain from the slowed metabolic rate and hormonal shifts. And it barely helped the pain, and made her so fatigued she would go an entire day without getting out of bed. Then Corticosteroids. Which didn’t even work. The pain was so bad I would hear my mother wake up in the night screaming in pain. I would run into her room, asking if she’s OK. Eventually I stopped getting up. She’d yell out anguished shrieks of wordless pain or the word “fuck” stretched and distended to its limits. I’d turn over and go back to sleep. All of this while they bled us dry with follow-up appointment after follow-up appointment, specialist consultations, and more imagine scans. Each appointment was promised to be fully covered, until the insurance claims were delayed and denied. Allopathic medicine did nothing to help my mother’s suffering. Yet it is the foundation of our entire society. My mother told me that on a good day the nerve pain was like her legs were immersed in ice water. On a bad day it felt like her legs were clamped in a machine shop vice, screwed down to where the cranks stopped turning, then crushed further until her ankle bones sprintered and cracked to accommodate the tightening clamp. She had more bad days than good. My mother crawled to the bathroom on her hands and knees. I slept in the living room to create more distance from her cries in the night. I still woke up, and still went back to sleep. Back then I thought there was nothing I could do.
The high copays made consistent treatment impossible. New treatments were denied as “not medically necessary.” Old treatments didn’t work, and still put us out for thousands of dollars. UnitedHealthcare limited specialist consultations to twice a year. Then they refused to cover advanced imaging, which the specialists required for an appointment. Prior authorizations took weeks, then months. UnitedHealthcare constantly changed their claim filing procedure. They said my mother’s doctor needed to fax his notes. Then UnitedHealthcare said they did not save faxed patient correspondence, and required a hardcopy of the doctor’s typed notes to be mailed. Then they said they never received the notes. They were unable to approve the claim until they had received and filed the notes. They promised coverage, and broke their word to my mother. With every delay, my anger surged. With every denial, I wanted to throw the doctor through the glass wall of their hospital waiting room. But it wasn’t them. It wasn’t the doctors, the receptionists, administrators, pharmacists, imaging technicians, or anyone we ever met. It was UnitedHealthcare.
People are dying. Evil has become institutionalized. Corporations make billions of dollars off the pain, suffering, death, and anguished cries in the night of millions of Americans. We entered into an agreement for healthcare with a legally binding contract that promised care commensurate with our insurance payments and medical needs. Then UnitedHealthcare changes the rules to suit their own profits. They think they make the rules, and think that because it’s legal that no one can punish them. They think there’s no one out there who will stop them.
Now my own chronic back pain wakes me in the night, screaming in pain. I sought out another type of healing that showed me the real antidote to what ails us. I bide my time, saving the last of my strength to strike my final blows. All extractors must be forced to swallow the bitter pain they deal out to millions.
As our own chief executives, it’s our obligation to make our own lives better. First and foremost, we must seek to improve our own circumstances and defend ourselves. As we do so, our actions have ripple effects that can improve the lives of others. Rules exist between two individuals, in a network that covers the entire earth. Some of these rules are written down. Some of these rules emerge from natural respect between two individuals. Some of these rules are defined in physical laws, like the properties of gravity, magnetism or the potential energy stored in the chemical bonds of potassium nitrate. No single document better encapsulates the belief that all people are equal in fundamental worth and moral status and the frameworks for fostering collective well-being than the US constitution. Writing a rule down makes it into a law. I don’t give a fuck about the law. Law means nothing. What does matter is following the guidance of our own logic and what we learn from those before us to maximize our own well-being, which will then maximize the well-being of our loved ones and community. That’s where UnitedHealthcare went wrong. They violated their contract with my mother, with me, and tens of millions of other Americans. This threat to my own health, my family’s health, and the health of our country’s people requires me to respond with an act of war. END
Can people stop spreading this without verifying the source?
I am skeptical given we have samples of his writing and that and that this has been circulated as his manifesto. Authorities have stated the manifesto is 262 words, handwritten (likely not copied digitally), and we have a quote from it stating he was working alone. This is in the area of 1500 words, reads like crap, does not include the quote, and does not account for the means of his family.
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Sure there might be a message to extract and generally I am open to talking about it, but at the moment most people are interested in the type of person this guy is and a fabricated message just doesn’t tell us anything.
all right, that’s fair too!
You sound like J.D. Vance
That. That right there will be the dumbest shit I will have read all day. It’s 9:46 am.
ITT: some really healthy skepticism over some of the “evidence” allegedly written by the shooter. I’m kinda impressed. Some other lemmy communities are leaning harder in to conspiracy ideas (planted evidence or whatever), but quite a few of the comments here are taking the time to analyze the info.
We really just don’t know yet. And likely won’t know until the trial (if there even will be a trial).
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Did you read anything past the first sentence?
I don’t get it
The libertarian flag is yellow and black. The anarchist flag is black and red.
The implication is that a libertarian only looks like an anarchist by proximity. As soon as they’re left to their own devices, they’re revealed to be Christian Nationalists (the black symbol on white robes is used by the Klan.)
thank you
What about the red armband?
Very badly rendered swastika flag. You can kinda sorta see the black pixels at the center making up the crooked cross.
That comic is so crusty that im surprised you can still see the red arm band.
I thought black and gold was the ancap flag, not libertarian.
It’s the same picture
Most ancaps/right-libertarians are often just right-authoritarians that like drugs, addicted to loli-hentai (although this one is falling out of fashion due to “nofap” reasons), weirdly “free speech extremists”, etc. Exceptions may apply.
I think labeling is so fucking stupid. Like I get that it’s easier to shove a label on people and yourself, but we’re seriously assigning an entire fucking socio-political economic identity to this kid from like 2 Goodreads reviews and a few Facebook posts?
Gimme a fucking break
They might be referring to anon’s flag in the greentext?
Don’t worry. It’s stupid.
Base on what I’ve read about this kid: I probably wouldn’t like him as a person. I probably wouldn’t agree with a lot of the things he believes, and I’d probably vehemently oppose a lot of it. I don’t think he’s a genius – in fact I think he’s probably a similar to the edgy, dumb kid I was at that age.
Sometimes “good” people do bad things, and sometimes “bad” people do good things: real people aren’t one dimensional caricatures.
Back pain is a hell of a drug.
Fortunately, back pain is in the drug formulary. Claim approved.
Law Abiding Citizen 2 plotline. Honestly this event really remind me of that movie, all those killed is worthy of “ohh no…anyway”
People are dying. Evil has become institutionalized. Corporations make billions of dollars off the pain, suffering, death, and anguished cries in the night of millions of Americans.
Based.
Is that a quote from him?
I got it from the top comment’s source, which, it seems “claims” to be his story.
He was activated as a sleeper agent by the [redacted]
Two lines from the bottom they are missing:
Discovered DOTA2
This implies the existence of two other CEO assassins working the Broadway and Wall Street lanes
lmao
