Literally nothing will get me to use this crypto scam of a browser.
I’ve used this for years and have never interacted with any crypto feature
That you know of
That sounds like fear mongering, but ok.
Brave was found to inject crypto referral links into your
clicksurl auto complete.https://www.tomsguide.com/news/brave-affiliate-links-autocomplete
They kind of just ignore that the crypto feature is opt-in.
The fact that the dev behind brave is a homophobe isn’t opt in though…
Also, their whole business model was (is?) just replacing ads with ads they get paid for.
Sure, but that’s opt-in. By default, it just blocks ads.
Uh… no? It just puts sponsored backgrounds when you open new tabs or windows notifications if you opt-in
It never replaced ads in websites afaik
They’re not actively replacing elements on a web page, but they’re still getting paid to show you ads and you can opt in for some crypto nonsense.
Sure, so? It’s still opt-in, and by default it sends the generated crypto money to creators and websites you visit
If you don’t like it, don’t enable it? They’re pretty transparent about how it works overall
They have pretty much abandoned this feature anyways
Sure, that sucks, but the product is good
You can’t always agree with everyone
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That’s saying that he left Mozilla for that. He’s still CEO of Brave
Can’t believe this poor reading comprehension is getting upvoted.
What’s amazing is they proved themselves wrong in their own post, thinking they proved themselves right. It’s actually impressive.
Thanks.
He left Mozilla (chased out because he’s a homophobe) and went on to found Brave, where he still remains
Ah, thank you for the clarification.
It’s okay, it’s never too late to switch.
Running Linux would block this feature too.
Just reason sayin.
Switching to Linux made me like computers again. Switching to Hyprland made me love computers again.
Switching to TempleOS made me hear the voices again.
Switching to Hannah Montana Linux made me hear The Best of Both Worlds again.
I want to use Corey in the House Linux
They got pills for that. Just sayin’
Same story here! Im in love with computing all over again because of it. Too bad many are tricked into thinking Microsoft ia the only option.
Hyprland made me suicidal again but we are all different
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There’s one in every thread.
There are dozens of us! Dozens!
Thats 96% of lemmy users
One?
Running Linux would block this feature too.
Keep In mind that you can still be captured by this feature indirectly,
Discord for example certainly doesn’t intend to do anything to hide your messages, they recently went public so in their eyes more tracking the better.Discord… Still isn’t public?
They’re certainly talking about it but they haven’t announced a date yet.
Having said that, element and matrix are both more privacy respecting so I do agree with the recommendation in general.
Discord… Still isn’t public?
They’re certainly talking about it but they haven’t announced a date yet.
Apologies, I striked the lines out of my previous comment. It simply was an example of how you still can be captured.
Actually, Linux doesn’t block windows, it just isn’t windows.
Just reason saying.
Tbf, anything that isn’t AI Windows blocks the feature. Including regular Windows.
People just need to not fall for the scam edition and they don’t have to deal with this shit.
Brave’s CEO is a homophobic Trump supporter. No thanks.
That’s not even the worst thing about him. He also invented JavaScript.
That’s it, brave is getting uninstalled from my PC NOW.
He invented JavaScript, so definitely don’t use that either. For real. JavaScript sucks.
I used to hate JS but barley had used it. Now I use it on a daily base and hate it even more.
JS is difficult to avoid. Brave is easy to avoid, just use another browser.
Does he run/have power over JavaScript right now?
No, not directly. Not any more than your average tech leader who goes to conferences and discusses it.
Oh wait hey you’re on my instance. Cool! We’re such small one lol
“It’s a small club and you
ain’tin it”—Warren Bullgates Lincolnham
😁 It’s an elite club.
Ah, you beat me to it.
I need a better option then. What can yall suggest?
He could be next husband of Ivanka Trump - I don’t care
If he provide good service for me - browser which fits my needs. I would even send him money every day
“I’ll support fascism as long as it’s convenient for me”
No. “I will support a good service and not mingle with politics”
If fascism was a passive philosophy that didn’t hurt anyone then you might have a point. But as you can see recently it’s extremely dangerous and ruins lives.
You may not want to mingle with politics, but it doesn’t have the same view.
Yep, everything is politics whether we like it or not.
One of the penalties for refusing to participate in politics is that you end up being governed by your inferiors.
Plato, The Republic bk. 1, 347c
That’s the logic of as long as it benefits ME I don’t care and I support them no matter what they do. This same logic has been applied to all the shitty things done in history like slavery, war and so forth, and the reason the world is the way it is.
Do you know all the personal histories of all the people related to all the services you use?
Of course that’s not possible, the issue here is being aware and not caring and in some cases supporting it for convenience and selfishness.
How does me using brave browser supports fascism?
In my country, one of the most successful supermarkets is run by a fascist and he uses part of his fortune to finance our local fascist party, which is gaining strength every year by the way. Do we support fascism by buying in that supermarket? What if we suddenly started to boycott the supermarket to hell?
My point is that they earn profits by using their services and in today’s society money is power. And from where the CEO got his power? From the millions of people with the mindset of “if it benefits me I don’t care”.
What does that have to do with the browser? Last I checked, browsers aren’t transphobic.
You do you, but I personally refuse to make product choices based on the person who makes it. Brave is the least bad chromium browser, so I use it as a backup to my main Gecko-based browser. I’m not a fan of Mozilla either, but that’s irrelevant since I pick my software based on what it does, not based on the management of the company that builds it.
Brave is the least bad chromium browser
It’s pretty sleazy. Ungoogled Chromium or Vivaldi are probably less sleazy, if at all.
Vivaldi is not open source, so for me it doesn’t count as a valid option.
I‘m not even pro Brave but all that ad stuff is opt-in so it doesn‘t matter as long as you don‘t want to see ads. The arguments in this thread are starting to just loop in circles. Essentially using Brave is fine if you stick to the default. There‘s no sleazy stuff if you don‘t enable it and the CEO also doesn‘t make a dime from you if that‘s something you‘re concerned about. You could of course use a different chromium browser if you want but it‘s virtually the same thing.
The only two there that bother me are the affiliate code thing (reminds me of the Honey drama) and installing extra software without consent. The first was a bad call and probably related with how their ad replacement stuff works (if anything, they should merely axe affiliate links; Firefox has that as an option), and this"solution" to the latter is pretty odd to me:
reinstall the browser without admin rights
Why would a browser need admin rights in the first place? I haven’t used Windows in well over a decade, so I don’t think that particular one would be an issue for me.
The rest can be grouped as:
- bugs - bug fixes generally don’t get prioritized until enough users complain; I would be very picky if I was an at risk person (activist or whatever) and would probably only use Tor browser
- opt-in services
- their marketing department
My options for chromium browsers are:
- something with ineffective ad blocking
- Opera - I used it before it became a chromium browser, then it went downhill; not FOSS
- Brave, with all its warts
Since ad blocking and FOSS are my prerequisites, Brave basically wins by default.
Just block with unlock 🙉 why choose browser based on a ad block feature that is worse (injecting own ads/adware and therefore trying to dictate who is allowed to grab your attention) than the ad blocking extension?
I recommend Firefox, due to best compatibility with uBlock (fuck manifest v3) and additionally have a DNS filter in your network, like pihole or adguard.
On the go, use wireguard VPN to always be digitally home, and get your ads blocked (as well as tracking organisations) like that.
I recommend Firefo
So do I, that’s my main. Brave is my backup for the handful of sites that don’t like Firefox.
I would not choose to use a product made by people I disagree with but leaving that aside:
Is it the least bad? Why not degoogled chrome? Or chromium? Even vivaldi seems like a better choice.
Ad blocking mostly. That’s literally all I need in a chromium browser, because I only use it on a handful of sites that don’t work properly in Firefox.
Chromium is also okay, but no ad blocker. I have that installed as well in the really unlikely case that the ad blocker gets in the way.
99% of my browsing is on a Firefox browser, and 99% of the rest is on Brave. I use it so infrequently the “time saved” metric is a merely seconds.
Actually, I consider Brave the best (or the least bed…) browser on the market. Period. The fact that it isn’t made by Mozilla is a plus for me.
I don’t like Mozilla either, but here are my priorities in a web browser:
- FOSS
- Privacy tools - includes ad blocking; I’d actually be okay with ads if they didn’t track me
- Promotes open web standards - rendering engine diversity is critical here, I don’t want a repeat of the IE era
- Security
- Performance
Firefox ticks all of them, and my issues with Mozilla as an org don’t really come into play. I use a fork on my phone, but I use Firefox on my laptop and desktop because I trust the binaries coming from my Linux distribution maintainers (part of 4).
Good for you. I actively refuse to use it or any of its derivatives to avoid endorsing Mozilla by giving them market share. Additionally, I find that Brave just performs better (and needs one extension less to be functional).
I care a lot about rendering engine diversity, and Firefox is the largest non-chromium browser, so I use it. It’s fast enough for me, and my handful of extensions gives me what I need.
Again, good for you.
Brave also ticks all of them?
at this point, Firefox’s development is not very much more open than Chromium’s
It doesn’t tick #3, hence why I use a Firefox browser as my main. If they had their own rendering engine, I would consider it as my main. But for now, it’s my backup in case I need a website that doesn’t work on Firefox (i.e. they use something Chrome-specific).
Valid point then. We need compatibility with gecko, I always found it better looking than chromium
The better option would be to not use spyware as an operating system.
Do you consider any form of telemetry “spyware”?
I don’t think taking screenshots of everything you do every few seconds is telemetry.
It’s not, but it’s also not spyware - it’s local, encrypted, AND optional.
Microsoft is known for making things “optional” at first then eventually forcing it down everyone’s throats. Removing offline accounts is one of them.
It’s not so much the technology itself is malware, but its behavior replicates that of malware.
Yes hello John Windows my microwave account name is Oobe\bypassnro
This also works: shift-F10 before you get to the network configuration, then type this and press enter start ms-cxh:localonly
For either method, if you configure networking during setup, e.g. plug in an ethernet cable or give it the wi-fi password, it’ll keep returning to the online account screen. You need to do it prior to network config.
Right. So you’re all panicking just in case.
That’s what’s being swept under the rug as “alarmists being loud”.
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The same way you have a lock on your front door “just in case”. It’s not emotional. It’s logical.
The lock is there. The whole thing is encrypted.
If they somehow go through encryption, they won’t just have the EU on their arses, governments of the entire world will be after them, because they trust that this encryption system makes their data secure.
Optional like how it reminds me every 3 days that it wants my info for “customization” purposes, and I can only sleep the notification for another 3 days instead of telling it to fuck off?
They have been so predatory, at this point no one should see anything they do as benefiting end users.
If it does that, outrage will be understandable.
Getting outraged about something they said will be 100% optional and hasn’t even released yet is just childish.
Actual optional things are disabled by default.
So you’re saying you haven’t bothered to read about Recall at all, you just assumed it’s going to be enabled by default?
Until a windows update kicks in and somehow turns it on for the world. thanks but no thanks. I’ll be disabling this not with a reg key but with local policy or DSC if I have to use a windows machine for personal again.
I switched to Linux 2 months ago.
Until a windows update kicks in and somehow turns it on for the world.
I don’t know if this is a regional thing, but I’ve been using Windows since 3.11 and have NEVER had ONE instance of an update randomly turning on something that I’ve turned off before.
Look at this bootlicker ignoring history and saying trust Microsoft.
“Look at this fossil thinking it’s still 1990”, I guess?
Mate, did you miss how 30 years have passed? How the world change? Can you even begin to imagine the fine the EU would slap without a second thought on MS if they tried pulling something like suddenly grabbing these screenshots from users’ devices?
You consider actual, literal spyware as being merely telemetry?
What are you talking about now?
I believe they are talking about Windows, an OS that is spyware and no one should use
An example of Windows being spyware not standard telemetry is the Recall feature. A feature that doesn’t just tell you how the OS is used but actually takes screenshots every few seconds
Windows, an OS that is spyware and no one should use
Of, ffs, grow up.
An example of Windows being spyware not standard telemetry is the Recall feature. A feature that doesn’t just tell you how the OS is used but actually takes screenshots every few seconds
You have no clue what you’re talking about, do you?
Recall only works on devices with an NPU. Do you know why? Because it runs locally. It’s got NOTHING to do with telemetry, because it does NOT send data to Microsoft.
Recall only works on devices with an NPU. Do you know why? Because it runs locally.
Show code or gtfo
LOL, this is hilarious :D
Imagine believing they can sneak gigabytes of network traffic without anyone noticing just because you can’t read the code! :D
Honestly it largely is.
Personally I like sharing crash reports, but even then, the user should be able to turn that off if you like.
Telemetry should be 100% opt-in.
Honestly it largely is.
I mean, by definition, it isn’t.
It’s anonymous and not malicious in nature. It’s a diagnostic and engagement measuring tool.
diagnostic
I think it is useful to send crash reports, but the user should have power over it (see: when macOS generates a crash report, it asks the user if they would like to send it)
engagement measuring
That is your data they are taking to make money off of without your consent, and I consider that malicious. There are ways to do that with consent. See: Steam’s annual hardware survey
That is your data they are taking to make money off of without your consent
I mean… They’re a for-profit company, so literally anything they do is to make money.
But it’s not “my data”, it’s anonymous. The “engagement” info is in relation to features. That’s why some features are removed - because nobody uses them. Or rather: not enough people use them to warrant maintenance.
And how do you know it’s not malicious in nature? I’d like to know what your definition of “malicious” is if you’re just fine with letting a Corpo run system look at everything you’re doing.
And how do you know it’s not malicious in nature?
Because I have a functioning brain.
I’d like to know what your definition of “malicious” is
Malware is designed to hurt you by extracting your personal information or resources.
Telemetry is designed to give developers feedback about product/functionality usage and is anonymous.
you’re just fine with letting a Corpo run system look at everything you’re doing.
I’m not, and it’s not. Unlike you, I actually checked what data telemetry gathers and I’m perfectly fine with it. It’s inconsequential and anonymous.
not malicious in nature
Haha, sure thing William
Are you a tech-illiterate person?
If not, explain how is it malicious.
how the hell do you not?
I don’t know, maybe because I understand the definition of “spyware” and “telemetry”?
Well, semantically yes, not all telemetry is spyware. However regarding Windows telemetry it’s indistinguishable from spyware - you have no idea nor control over the data gathered, measured and processed.
The crux is that Windows telemetry is opt out, opting out can’t be done during installation, and historically opting out wasn’t sticky. Additionally some Windows telemetry is still being sent despite opting out.
That makes Windows telemetry fulfill all spyware criteria.
However regarding Windows telemetry it’s indistinguishable from spyware - you have no idea nor control over the data gathered, measured and processed
Ah, so you’re another one of those fear-mongers?
Here’s the Required Diagnostic Events Fields (required telemetry) documentation.
Keeping in mind that it’s anonymous - which parts of this are you so vehemently against sending to Microsoft?
That makes Windows telemetry fulfill all spyware criteria.
The shittiest spyware in history, I guess, considering it’s all anonymous…
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Brave 🤮
Windows 🤮
“feature” 🤮
Truffle Shuffle 🤮
Kirby vacuuming blended spinach 🤮
Wait, what?
I mean Mozilla’s Firefox is 🤮 too… there’s no perfect browser
nothing is perfect, except the horseshoe crab. however both librewolf and cromite are great with ublock, and ltsc windows has no copilot since companies use that edition.
Librewolf is too restrictive and not suitable for everyday browsing. I hate it.
never tested cromite
im pretty sure you can disable a ton of stuff in the options menu
Yeah but for example fingerprinting is either fully on or fully off
Switching defaults hurt fingerprinting more than it helps so at that point might as well stay with the default firefox
Unfortunately that would involve using the Brave browser, which is an antifeature in itself.
yeah, no, i’m not using your shitty browser.
But it’s funded by an unrepentant homophobe! How can you pass on that?!
An unrepentant homophobe who accused people who dislike him for his homophobic views/actions as being closed-minded and bigoted for disliking him over it.
You can’t make this shit up
It’s probably the best chromium browser out there
Firefox has done shit too
sadly we don’t have a lot of choice, but they’re one of the least worse
Firefox has done shit too
Firefox has injected my URLs with affiliate codes?
Nope, but it put a closed source Mr Robot plugin without asking anyone
Just don’t use Chromium unless you for some reason absolutely have to. Mozilla is just another corporation, but they’re not exactly threatening to monopolise the internet. Google is, and using Chromium directly aids in their effort to do so.
It’s not that bad. Sure, having more choice is good, but it’s not as life threatening as you make it seem
Using android and stock ROMs is a bigger problem
I think it’s a compounding issue, primarily of Google products just kind of being the “default.”
Google pays to be the primary search engine in Firefox, on iOS, and sets themselves as the default on their operating systems. They, wherever possible also set their browser as default. Yes, Chromium is open source, but they have the ultimate final say, and no one seems to have the interest in forking it. This puts Google in a similar position that Microsoft was in in the 90s and early 00s, where they can essentially hijack the web and force their ideas through whether others want to or not.
We saw this with Google forcing Manifest v3, all Chromium-based browsers essentially just had to follow suit. That was just Manifest v3 however, who’s to say what else they’ll do?
Then there’s my tinfoil hat worry that Google essentially being the window to the web for so many people, on an OS, browser, and discoverability level is just overall a cause for worry. That’s not even considering their communications and media platforms.
I’m pretty sure if Firefox/Mozilla decides to change their policy on something, most forks of firefox will have no choice but follow the same path
afaik all firefox forks are really small, just like chromium forks
Mozilla might not have as much conflicting interests though, I admit it
Oh yeah, absolutely. There are no good options for a truly libre web, unfortunately. :(
Perfect is the enemy of good.
Gecko is still way more sympathetic than chromium, to me. Even if it is not perfect either.
sure there are choices. I don’t use either. if you believe there are only 2 choices out there…man you have no idea.
Usable and mainstream choices? I’m unsure
Linux blocks that “feature” too…
What feature?? Recall? That’s Windows 11-specific and hasn’t even launched yet??
The joke is that Linux blocks this by not doing it at all. Which is why people should switch to Linux. Which is a good idea. But that’s up to the people.
I love this comment so much
Let me know when it is discovered that they in fact replaced MS Recall with their own version that was scraping your data in yet another sketchy attempt to make money.
BUT… most people really don’t care about that, they just want to remove ads from facebook or youtube or whatever…
My clients couldn’t care less about what the CEO does, heck they still think facebook is the dogs danglies and youtube is cutting edge plus Netflix is the best streaming service.
Fighting that is way harder than then trying to explain that some software is worse than others. Heck plenty still use Photoshop because they don’t understand that alternatives exist and “everyone at work uses it”
In this thread something I see a lot on lemmy is happening. Maybe someone can give me a hint on how that happens. The post itself is 90% upvotes, while the comment section is really anti-Brave (for good reasons). Do most upvotes come from people scrolling through without looking at the comment section and those with an opinion on the topic dive into it?
I upvote the post because I support the feature, and would like to see more browsers implement more privacy focused features.
I upvote the anti-Brave comments, because fuck Brave.
The post itself is reasonable quality and informative so I find it upvote worthy. If a post is low quality or a shit post then I downvote.
To me the karma system is about quality. Not an “I agree/disagree” button.
For comments I only down vote obvious trolls, bigots/racism etc.
To me the karma system is about quality. Not an “I agree/disagree” button.
That’s how it was meant to be. The original Rediquette from over 15 years ago has:
“Vote. If you think something contributes to conversation, upvote it. If you think it does not contribute to the subreddit it is posted in or is off-topic in a particular community, downvote it.
[Please don’t] Downvote an otherwise acceptable post because you don’t personally like it. Think before you downvote and take a moment to ensure you’re downvoting someone because they are not contributing to the community dialogue or discussion. If you simply take a moment to stop, think and examine your reasons for downvoting, rather than doing so out of an emotional reaction, you will ensure that your downvotes are given for good reasons.”But 99% of people definitely use them as an Agree/Disagree button.
Well, one could argue if just posting a link with a title is a ‘quality’ post. But the topic is still worth a discussion so I don’t see why it should be downvoted.
The problem is that people routinely upvote bullshit, falsehoods, and flat out disinformation. Just because it was well written does not make it true.
I think you should not downvote a post you have a negative opinion about. If the post is worth to discuss then why should I not upvote the post and then say that I disagree in the comments. If we all down vote those posts nobody will see it (apart of those who sort by controversial) and there will be no discussion.
If the software in question is bad, then I’d like to reduce visibility of the post while explaining why in the comments.
Brave is connected to the BAT pay-to-surf scam. Its CEO donates to homophobic causes.
Most people never bother to read anything beyond the title of the post. Let alone click the link to the article.
Now, i don’t know how everyone sees up/down votes. But I always thought that content and comments that is relevant and promotes discussion is good. And comments that aren’t are bad.
Rather than a measure of others opinions.
It seems to me most people simply upvote the post to reward OP for bringing things up, exposing etc. Comments serve opinions on the topic itself, but upvote/downvote is more for if it’s good according to community rules and if the topic itself is interesting.
I’ve noticed this on political posts too, among others and I’ve wondered the same thing.
I upvote posts that I think are worth being seen by more people. That includes posts about topics that I don’t like or agree with, but think people need to know is happening and I think to know that are not including disinformation or misinformation or opinion written as facts.
This still doesn’t make brave a good privacy browser in the long run
yeah but it’s run by an active opponent of LGBT folks
Sometimes bad people do good things.
I would not call brave good…
A device that surreptitiously gathers information on a target is called a bug, not a feature.
More like malware
yup. how do people continue using Winblows :/
It’s actually super simple: even though the community is called “Technology”, there’s A LOT of tech-illiterate fear mongering going on here. People behave like Microsoft is trying to spy on them, seemingly oblivious to the fact that Recall is:
- only available on devices with an NPU.
- local only, nothing goes out to the Internet (hence the NPU requirement).
- opt-in - you need to turn it on yourself.
There’s nothing malicious about it. Functionality is questionable, but acting like it’s malware is just showing ignorance.
Well, not really, a bug is unintentional. Even calling it a design flaw is a stretch, it’s a feature that isn’t for your benefit.“Bug” also means “listening device.”
If it was intentional double entendre then I retract my comment, but used in the context of “bugs and features” there’s a contextual implication.
It was wordplay, yes.
I retract.
It’s not a bug, it’s a feature we don’t like 🤣
So, you’re saying that browsing history, in literally any browser on the market, is a bug not a feature?
surreptitiously
Oh, wait, I actually missed that! How is something that you need to purposefully turn on “surreptitious”? Like… Holy fuck, people, this is supposed to be the community of tech-literate people, so maybe stop fear-mongering in read about Recall a bit? It’s opt-in, it’s limited to a (as of now) extremely small number of NPU-carrying devices, it’s offline.
If you don’t like it, just don’t fucking turn it on.
It’s a good thing that microsoft is trustworthy and you can believe everything they say. And that malware never misuses resources of the system on which it is installed.
Recall sits in a secure vault behind BitLocker encryption secured with Windows Hello.
BitLocker+Windows Hello gets broken through, the world has a much larger problem than some screenshots, because that’s the foundation of, like, 80% of enterprise security.
If you’re afraid that an attacker sits on your PC and just waits for you to unlock the vault, then you already have the PC breached to the point where they don’t have to do that, they already have access to everything else.
If you’re afraid of the feature in anyway, don’t use it.
You trust microsoft implicitly no matter what they do, I get it.
I don’t. I read tech specs and security analyses. You just stick your head in the sand whenever someone says “Microsoft”, though. It’s silly.
I don’t trust them and they have given me sufficient reason over the course of decades not to.
So you still think it’s 1990. Got it. Well, times have changed. We have better oversight. The EU has GDPR, user data is better protected. If they tried to pull off a “heist” and suddenly start grabbing these screenshots from users, the fine from EU would be historical.
