reads some comments
makes a couple comments
reads more comments
…
…
I came across a vidya on the interwebs many hears ago where a monkey grabbed a frog and used it as a fleshlight… Ever since then Ive had a different relationship with the word “unnatural”. The truth is that shoving your arm up a cows ass and eating vegan fervantly and being a hater ass bitch are all perfect examples of natural human behaviour…and im well past thinking theyre not.
You know, i used to have more heated discussions about this, but now i feel like I matured a different view on this, at all. I conceive the freedom to chose on a personal ethical base above the idea of punching down ideas just because. Ideally, being vegan is just that, being vegan. You can be whatever… It’s not mandatory to be either.
I eventually found out that any amount of rage or hate for that was only projection of my special insecurities.
I conceive the freedom to chose on a personal ethical base above the idea of punching down ideas just because.
I agree it’s a choice, but I don’t think it’s a personal one given that there is another sentient being victimized in the action.
A bit on the motivation behind vegan activism:
Say you’re against needlessly exploiting animals. And you purchase/produce animal products when there are other options available. You would be needlessly exploiting animals while affirming a contradiction, that would be hypocrisy. Nobody can force you to act on that, but they can point what you’re accountable for.
Vegans believe that most people are against needlessly exploiting animals, so they try to show this to people. Confusion may get in the way, but wanting to put on the spotlight what kind of exploitation people are supporting is what guides them.
I don’t know. I find the people insisting that farmers are the same as pedophiles to be pretty infuriating personally.
Because i don’t want to deal in extremes any longer. We milked that vegan teacher for content long enough, we should know better now. Most vegans are not the vegan teacher, as a matter of fact
You know what fuck you too for apologizing for these fucks
Most vegans might not be (doubt), but every vegan arguing in this thread is or they wouldn’t be here.
I had a vegan roommate for years. I didn’t cook much meat when he was in the house. But I was never personally vegan. I also did agree that it’s more ethical to not kill for your food, let alone all the other horrors of factory farming. And I’m able to accept that I don’t live up to that more ethical standard.
I think maybe people just don’t like to think someone (especially annoying people) might be doing something better than they are? Like you said, special insecurities.
Discussions like this usually get heated fast. At the end of the day, people make food choices for different ethical, cultural, and practical reasons — it’s probably more productive to talk about systems and standards than attack each other.
I mean… it is.
Looking at this directly from a viewpoint of what is “natural” for the human body, being vegan is unnatural.
Being an omnivore is. Our entire digestive system is such that the natural diet of the human body is an omnivorous one and it does best when treated as such. And that means a small amount of animal fats, proteins, trace minerals, and amino acids in one’s diet.
I’m not going to argue morals or ethics, because that wasn’t what the post was about. It’s what’s about what is “natural.”
Yes, you may disagree with me. Strenuously, and just know that I respect you and hope that you and yours have an excellent day wherever you happen to be on this flaming cannonball of a planet we call home.
I tried it for 8 years and my body started to fall to pieces in rather remarkable ways
My take on the veganism I’ve come to know personally is that vegans think they put themselves in the place of animals, but what I see is they put the animals in their own place. In this case, they think that consent should be placed in the animal realm because they believe it for themselves.
Why is this the top post for like the last week?
Make vegan food free if you care about animals so much.
Mr.Vegan you realize that cows don’t have a cloaca right?
I don’t think that’s the right hole for that, weirdo.
ITT being morally superior punching down on vegans complaining that they act morally superior and punch down. All done under a photo of someone elbow deep in cow.
Vegan milks are nice to drink, but they are very very different to real milk. Having tea with oat milk is a sacrifice (almond and coconut are worse for tea - they lack the sweetness that counteracts the bitter elements of tea), it doesn’t taste as good but it’s ok. It’s a small sacrifice to make, but a persistent one (given that many of us rely on caffeine to function at work).
There is a moral argument to be made, and the moral argument has the high ground if you avoid looking too carefully (nothing in life is simple).
The real crux of the vegan argument is “can people also sacrifice this”, or is it one sacrifice too many in the world of compromises we endure. That’s a personal choice, and given the state of the world today, it isn’t one many will be able to make.
In my experience sacrifice is a relative matter, and soon dissipates. Every abstained choice gets replaced with an alternative, and the more alternatives that are explored the more it becomes apparent that there is an entire culinary world that has been ignored. It becomes apparent that what felt like sacrifice is in fact opportunity, and those opportunities are well worth investigating in full.
If you keep exploring plant-based options you will be a lot more likely to find what works for you, than if you just give up.
It should also be noted, dairy impairs the bioavailability of beneficial plant-based compounds. Here are a few studies. Milk and coffee. Milk and blueberries. And Milk and tea.
That’s an interesting perspective - no promises but I’ll give it a go and audit the stats on those papers.
If true, the price may be worth it.
It has been for me. As a fellow tea enjoyer, lung function, gut health, a melting away of aching joints and physical malaise, seasonal allergy alleviation, and a shockingly boosted immune system are all benefits that I’ve personally enjoyed since going fully plant-based. Most likely heart benefits as well, but I won’t know for sure until I get my cholesterol levels tested.
But of course personal anecdotes are not valid evidence. Which is fine, because the science largely favors diets that are at least mostly plant-centric anyway.
As an up, coffee with oat milk tastes better than with cows milk :) ymmv obviously.
Very true but coffee has a very unfortunate effect on my innards so I’m locked out of that one!
my sympathies :/ then again, I also used to drink way too much & toned down quite a bit
between you drinking tea without milk and mom losing her child for said milk your “sacrifice” seems kinda like just entitlement.
Straight to ad hominem - nothing of value to engage with here.
Ad hominem fallacy is when the person is attacked as an invalidation of an argument.
You were defending the ethics of drinking cow’s milk, so talking about the ethics of drinking cow’s milk is perfectly on topic and not a fallacy. Otherwise, you’d be able to claim ad hominem on ANY counterargument!
Ad HoMiNeM
lmao I wasn’t attacking your person (I am now though lol) I was calling your act entitled, based on the argument before. Yeah if you think you’re entitled to kill anothers child and take her milk, that’s entitlement. Literally the definition lmfao, begging redditors to actually look up the terms they use
You’re literally having this discussion while looking at rape porn.
I go shopping and see dissected corpses on display. I take the train and the ads show me people feasting on ground up, charred corpses. This is the standard background radiation to everyday life.
It was put here by someone claiming to share your values.
It was. I don’t understand your point.
Cows milk is gross. Give me soy all day every day. Better tasting, better for you, better for the environment, better for the animals.
Talking about milk (why drinking milk from a different species? Would you drink milk from a dog? Or from a neighbours women? If not - why not?)
… fun fact, lactose intolerant is actually the normal form. Approx 75% of all humans world-wide are lactose intolerant.
The fact that people in “western world” can drink milk (and lactose) has been trained for some thousand years.
That’s why veganism should be forced on people (just shutting down factory farms would drive up meat prices so much it might be enough)
Honestly, I’m in favour of this, but that worries me.
In general, such actions will also raise the price of other goods as demand increase. You’d also need to keep non-meat prices low, and that’ll be expensive, meaning cuts elsewhere.
Making the world vegan isn’t just about stopping the meat industry, that’s rather like pulling cogs from a machine and praying it still runs. It’s about designing a better machine that doesn’t need those cogs, sacrificing to build it, and making sure it really is better.
For the vegan path that means sustainable agriculture (it isn’t at the moment), replicating tastes and caloric density (a key element of human culture), avoiding creating new issues (e.g. overuse of sugar, dietary issues with mycelial/nut sensitivity), and pushing food costs down.
So, if you want the world to be vegan, drop your current life and start working on the above!
We throw so much veg and bread and everything away, I would say it’s likely there’s plenty for everyone to eat even if we stopped producing meat this very instance. But obviously no one is arguing for that because that isn’t feasible. We don’t have the numbers (yet) to force this.
Reduction in waste is also a key step yes, one in which gains are being made. Teaching simple preservation techniques (e.g. oven toasting old bread) is also a good route to doing this.
It’s not about the individuals, I wasn’t even thinking of a household throwing away food when I wrote the comment. But the tons and tons and tons and tons of groceries shops throw out because people didn’t buy it. The harvests that are left to rot because transporting them wouldn’t be profitable. I don’t think me throwing out three day old bread is going to be that much less wasteful than heating up the oven rehumidifying it.
You WILL eat your veggies and you WILL be happy!
there’s food that isn’t just veggies that also isn’t created from animal enslavement
True but most carnists weaning off the slaughter should be eating mostly veggies until their body is in a good place again.
just eat whatever you find tasty lol
The vegan burgers are too good, I’d die
I don’t care anymore. If yall think animals are people then yall can be animals.
This thread brought me from thinking vegans were dumb but harmless to actively despising you. Good job.
You people are sick.
Im kicking a puppy for every downvote. Fuck you.
